Old Adversaries
11-20-2008, 07:48 AM
#41
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2005
Position: Retired
Posts: 2,934
UAL T38, Jungle, et al:
Neat stories. The F4 was one of the all-time greats. Considering that it's the only aircraft that all three branches used shows just how good it was.
Living close to STL I got to see a lot of them growing up and still remember the retirement flight for the last one by the MO ANG. It was a real treat to see one a couple years ago at Boeing with fresh paint. Sadly it's new role was to be shot down by somebody flying something newer.
I was really impressed with how quiet that thing was after the huffer was removed. Got a great pic of it making a low pass, just wish I could find it. The noise is etched in my mind forever though
Neat stories. The F4 was one of the all-time greats. Considering that it's the only aircraft that all three branches used shows just how good it was.
Living close to STL I got to see a lot of them growing up and still remember the retirement flight for the last one by the MO ANG. It was a real treat to see one a couple years ago at Boeing with fresh paint. Sadly it's new role was to be shot down by somebody flying something newer.
I was really impressed with how quiet that thing was after the huffer was removed. Got a great pic of it making a low pass, just wish I could find it. The noise is etched in my mind forever though
11-21-2008, 11:19 AM
#42
pants on the ground
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: back seat
Posts: 1,359
awesome stories......i've heard of a f-4 driver doing a parabolic climb/descent to obtain M2. On the final descent they decided to go back up, around 65,000+/- they had a flame out. Anyways, he hammerheaded(?) it and got it relit around 5,000. they're still alive for all i know lol.
11-21-2008, 01:13 PM
#43
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: 17 S.E. of Kedzi
Posts: 71
The F-4 is my favorite fighter and I like the stories from those who flew it. There is a cool book called "Once a Fighter Pilot". It is all stories of someone who flew them in 'Nam.
I went to Tucson last June and seen the rows and rows of them, some of which will be used for drones.
I went to Tucson last June and seen the rows and rows of them, some of which will be used for drones.
11-21-2008, 11:06 PM
#44
With The Resistance
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Burning the Agitprop of the Apparat
Posts: 6,191
A few more stories.
A friend took his first flight in an F-4. We had no aircraft with rear seat controls, an IP was placed in the back seat and they were very brave men.
Student goes to afterburner for takeoff. Student cannot pull throttles out of afterburner. They spend a bit of time time zorching around in AB. 1200 lbs per minute. They now have ten minutes to ejection. Frantic struggle with the throttles, a government issue ballpoint is finally dislodged after many + and minus high G whifferdills. Safe landing.
Some fool, could it be your faithful correspondent? Points the nose vertical in a fight. Padlocked on the bogey, speed goes to ZERO. Tailslide and various undocumented AB influenced maneuvers ensue. Falling like a greased manhole cover in a vacuum. Ejection is looming at 10k. Smooth falling leaf exit and beers all around. 300 hours and so much skill.
Another dark night over the sea of Japan a friend managed to tear off fifty feet of tanker hose and bring it back to base. The aircraft was thrashed like it had been beaten like a rented donkey, those were the good old days. Numerous holes and tears in the fuselage. Luckey it didn't tear the probe off and suck all the JP out.
All in all a good tour. We only managed to kill about 10% of the squadron.
Then there was the delight of pulling off a target, rolling inverted as you entered a cloud deck and then pulling the nose down for another pass. It was so funny we couldn't stop laughing.
A friend took his first flight in an F-4. We had no aircraft with rear seat controls, an IP was placed in the back seat and they were very brave men.
Student goes to afterburner for takeoff. Student cannot pull throttles out of afterburner. They spend a bit of time time zorching around in AB. 1200 lbs per minute. They now have ten minutes to ejection. Frantic struggle with the throttles, a government issue ballpoint is finally dislodged after many + and minus high G whifferdills. Safe landing.
Some fool, could it be your faithful correspondent? Points the nose vertical in a fight. Padlocked on the bogey, speed goes to ZERO. Tailslide and various undocumented AB influenced maneuvers ensue. Falling like a greased manhole cover in a vacuum. Ejection is looming at 10k. Smooth falling leaf exit and beers all around. 300 hours and so much skill.
Another dark night over the sea of Japan a friend managed to tear off fifty feet of tanker hose and bring it back to base. The aircraft was thrashed like it had been beaten like a rented donkey, those were the good old days. Numerous holes and tears in the fuselage. Luckey it didn't tear the probe off and suck all the JP out.
All in all a good tour. We only managed to kill about 10% of the squadron.
Then there was the delight of pulling off a target, rolling inverted as you entered a cloud deck and then pulling the nose down for another pass. It was so funny we couldn't stop laughing.
Last edited by jungle; 11-21-2008 at 11:38 PM.
11-22-2008, 06:28 AM
#45
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Corporate
Posts: 223
What are the chances some of these will enter the civilan ranks in the future? Sure would be nice to see some at airshows or in private hangers like the L-39s. No comparison I know but still cool.
Such a waste to die as a drone!
FBP
11-22-2008, 06:44 AM
#46
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: C172 Left
Posts: 642
One aircraft, an F-4D (civilian registration NX749CF), is operated by the Massachusetts-based non-profit organization Collings Foundation as a "living history" exhibit. Funds to maintain and operate the aircraft, which is based in Houston, Texas, are raised through donations/sponsorships from public and commercial parties.
11-22-2008, 11:19 AM
#47
Moderate Moderator
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: Curator at Static Display
Posts: 5,681
There is one....
The Collings Foundation flies a restored F-4D, painted to look like Steve Ritchie's mount, from its base at Ellington Field, TX.
I know the Chief Pilot (Harry Daye; D-Day to his buds) and have my resume on file!!
The pilots do it for volunteer work. They're all airline guys who will fly it to an airshow, then usually jumpseat out, and another guy brings it home or to the next show.
It was featured in an issue of The Robb Report, a magazine for non-airline pilots (ie, guys with oodles of money).
If you want a ride in it: You can get a ride in it under the auspices of flight training. You pay for the "Ground School," then get a "free" 45-minute ride. Last I heard, it was $10,000.
They also have an A-4J, similar deal, but about $7500 for a ride. Both jets are beautifully restored.
The F-4 was sidelined for almost two years after the right engine sucked in a loose bolt. Collings owns 5 spare engines (all at Davis-Monthan), but the curator of the Air Force Museum and he were in a pi$$ing match, and the curator wouldn't release them.
Seems that said Steve Ritchie pulled political strings to get the jet released/approved under the 1996 Defense authorization bill, because he was supposed to fly it. (Yes, it really took an "Act of Congress" to let if fly!!) When he and Collings started butting heads later, Ritchie pulled strings to keep it grounded.....or so I hear.
Check it out on their website.
Jungle, I too did an unintentional zero-airspeed tailslide as you describe, under similar circumstances---except I was in a slatted jet, and it swapped ends, wobbled once, and kept going. The guy I was fighting didn't even know it happened, and I never had a chance to call "Knock It Off."
Former Bus:
The current estimated cost of flying the F-4 (my estimate) is at least 2000 gals (or 10-12000 lbs) of jet fuel an hour, so $6-8000 an hour just for fuel. That doesn't include maintenance costs, and broken fighter parts are expensive.
Over $2.00 a second....bring lots of quarters for this video game.
I know the Chief Pilot (Harry Daye; D-Day to his buds) and have my resume on file!!
The pilots do it for volunteer work. They're all airline guys who will fly it to an airshow, then usually jumpseat out, and another guy brings it home or to the next show.
It was featured in an issue of The Robb Report, a magazine for non-airline pilots (ie, guys with oodles of money).
If you want a ride in it: You can get a ride in it under the auspices of flight training. You pay for the "Ground School," then get a "free" 45-minute ride. Last I heard, it was $10,000.
They also have an A-4J, similar deal, but about $7500 for a ride. Both jets are beautifully restored.
The F-4 was sidelined for almost two years after the right engine sucked in a loose bolt. Collings owns 5 spare engines (all at Davis-Monthan), but the curator of the Air Force Museum and he were in a pi$$ing match, and the curator wouldn't release them.
Seems that said Steve Ritchie pulled political strings to get the jet released/approved under the 1996 Defense authorization bill, because he was supposed to fly it. (Yes, it really took an "Act of Congress" to let if fly!!) When he and Collings started butting heads later, Ritchie pulled strings to keep it grounded.....or so I hear.
Check it out on their website.
Jungle, I too did an unintentional zero-airspeed tailslide as you describe, under similar circumstances---except I was in a slatted jet, and it swapped ends, wobbled once, and kept going. The guy I was fighting didn't even know it happened, and I never had a chance to call "Knock It Off."
Former Bus:
The current estimated cost of flying the F-4 (my estimate) is at least 2000 gals (or 10-12000 lbs) of jet fuel an hour, so $6-8000 an hour just for fuel. That doesn't include maintenance costs, and broken fighter parts are expensive.
Over $2.00 a second....bring lots of quarters for this video game.
Last edited by UAL T38 Phlyer; 11-22-2008 at 11:25 AM.
11-22-2008, 11:31 AM
#48
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,839
UAL -
The real question is did you call the SNAP just to keep him off his gameplan? 
USMCFLYR
PS....I'm probably one of the few of my timeframe that got to ride in the F-4. Mine was a F-4S model and the time was 1990 when I was stashed pre-flight school with VMFA-112 (MAG-41) based out of old NAS Dallas.
I too did an unintentional zero-airspeed tailslide as you describe, under similar circumstances---except I was in a slatted jet, and it swapped ends, wobbled once, and kept going. The guy I was fighting didn't even know it happened, and I never had a chance to call "Knock It Off."
USMCFLYR
PS....I'm probably one of the few of my timeframe that got to ride in the F-4. Mine was a F-4S model and the time was 1990 when I was stashed pre-flight school with VMFA-112 (MAG-41) based out of old NAS Dallas.
11-24-2008, 12:58 PM
#50
Weekends off? HA!
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 991
One more F-4 tale from SJAFB;
I watched two depart, being transferred to Langley, and didn't give them much thought. Working on the flightline, I saw a BIG plume of black smoke coming from the general direction of my house, about 10 miles away. ALL the crash trucks rolled and left the base. Turns out (we were told) one ship lost all hydraulics and was left to impact in a field. It DID come back to Seymour,
on a flat-bed semi...what was left of it.('77, '78 time frame, if I remember right)
I watched two depart, being transferred to Langley, and didn't give them much thought. Working on the flightline, I saw a BIG plume of black smoke coming from the general direction of my house, about 10 miles away. ALL the crash trucks rolled and left the base. Turns out (we were told) one ship lost all hydraulics and was left to impact in a field. It DID come back to Seymour,
on a flat-bed semi...what was left of it.('77, '78 time frame, if I remember right)
