UPS to hire 300 in 2017
11-12-2016, 09:01 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,339
New Venting Thread
May I kindly ask you to repost your questions to Sideshow here? ..and for him, flyphisher and others to reply there?
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/up...ml#post2242395
I created that thread so we can keep the "new airplanes", "hiring" and other threads on topic.
You have some very valid points but it'd be so much better if we could keep positive and negative news somewhat separate?
We've had so many years of absolute misery. Let's enjoy some good news every now and then..
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/up...ml#post2242395
I created that thread so we can keep the "new airplanes", "hiring" and other threads on topic.
You have some very valid points but it'd be so much better if we could keep positive and negative news somewhat separate?
We've had so many years of absolute misery. Let's enjoy some good news every now and then..
11-12-2016, 09:42 PM
#32
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 90
Shaggy,
2 is not 6. Having said that on the one hand 2 is too many. On the other hand I've never had cancer as Sideshow has so as much as his 2 JA's were there, I don't know if he's "out of the woods" as a cancer survivor and was trying to stockpile his sick should he need it. He will have to deal with that on his own.
You are definitely not a liar. I believe from my interaction with you that you are a good guy straight shooter. You do say it as you see it.
Same again.....having said that, to be honest (and I really am), the sword fighting we've done over the past year or so here is to try to help you so you don't blow an artery. I know you don't need my help. It's not "help". It's education? I don't know what I'd call it. I do feel that your extremes of the pen come across with anger and a viewpoint of the industry that a (to use a metaphor) 5 year old that gets knocked down on the playground for the first time and head swirls with the injustice of it. And as parents we say well dude welcome to the world.
You're not a child; however, your viewpoints however in the purest sense of notion are correct.....but in my view just aren't reality.
As much as I would have liked to base my whole vote on the 250, I wasn't going to do it. And Stilly hates me today for it. Thinks I'm a wuss and a sellout. I can't help that. I disagree with him. Retirement retro is unprecedented. And you and I come retirement? Won't even be a footnote.
Things are good at UPS Shaggy. In my view we all remain very lucky to be there. But I have a different view knowing just how bad it can be. Those lucky enough to get directly out of the military and into a viable airline job do have a different prism. But they usually catch on real quick that it's no longer Duty Honor Country. And the bully on the playground ...... company XYZ ......are going to do heinous labor practices designed to infuriate the hourlies. It's the nature of the business. And in my view continues to be all business. It feels pretty personal at times.....but it's designed that way.
Usually guys like yourself take that unbridled passion of right and wrong and go into the union committees. I'm not saying that age old of "well the union always needs help ....mouth". I'm not saying that. But I am saying you might enjoy it. Because you certainly have a lot of passion. And it could be turned into good.
Peace Brother. Just don't want to see you blow a gasket. Honest.
2 is not 6. Having said that on the one hand 2 is too many. On the other hand I've never had cancer as Sideshow has so as much as his 2 JA's were there, I don't know if he's "out of the woods" as a cancer survivor and was trying to stockpile his sick should he need it. He will have to deal with that on his own.
You are definitely not a liar. I believe from my interaction with you that you are a good guy straight shooter. You do say it as you see it.
Same again.....having said that, to be honest (and I really am), the sword fighting we've done over the past year or so here is to try to help you so you don't blow an artery. I know you don't need my help. It's not "help". It's education? I don't know what I'd call it. I do feel that your extremes of the pen come across with anger and a viewpoint of the industry that a (to use a metaphor) 5 year old that gets knocked down on the playground for the first time and head swirls with the injustice of it. And as parents we say well dude welcome to the world.
You're not a child; however, your viewpoints however in the purest sense of notion are correct.....but in my view just aren't reality.
As much as I would have liked to base my whole vote on the 250, I wasn't going to do it. And Stilly hates me today for it. Thinks I'm a wuss and a sellout. I can't help that. I disagree with him. Retirement retro is unprecedented. And you and I come retirement? Won't even be a footnote.
Things are good at UPS Shaggy. In my view we all remain very lucky to be there. But I have a different view knowing just how bad it can be. Those lucky enough to get directly out of the military and into a viable airline job do have a different prism. But they usually catch on real quick that it's no longer Duty Honor Country. And the bully on the playground ...... company XYZ ......are going to do heinous labor practices designed to infuriate the hourlies. It's the nature of the business. And in my view continues to be all business. It feels pretty personal at times.....but it's designed that way.
Usually guys like yourself take that unbridled passion of right and wrong and go into the union committees. I'm not saying that age old of "well the union always needs help ....mouth". I'm not saying that. But I am saying you might enjoy it. Because you certainly have a lot of passion. And it could be turned into good.
Peace Brother. Just don't want to see you blow a gasket. Honest.
11-12-2016, 09:56 PM
#33
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: On Food Stamps
Posts: 937
Thanks man, no worries. I pulled up the JA list when the interest appeared on the B&G and his name was on it for 6 legs. Maybe it was two trips, but six legs as it appeared; while at the same time he was giving $ hit to guys for picking up opentime and seasoned advice! I don't care about the reason why he is justifying now, but to his own admission the company was desperate and he was helping them! This is not slanderous accusation like saying someone was almost fired, this was in print on the IPA website. I don't make stuff up like he does when his back is up against the wall!
11-12-2016, 09:59 PM
#34
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: On Food Stamps
Posts: 937
May I kindly ask you to repost your questions to Sideshow here? ..and for him, flyphisher and others to reply there?
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/up...ml#post2242395
I created that thread so we can keep the "new airplanes", "hiring" and other threads on topic.
You have some very valid points but it'd be so much better if we could keep positive and negative news somewhat separate?
We've had so many years of absolute misery. Let's enjoy some good news every now and then..
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/up...ml#post2242395
I created that thread so we can keep the "new airplanes", "hiring" and other threads on topic.
You have some very valid points but it'd be so much better if we could keep positive and negative news somewhat separate?
We've had so many years of absolute misery. Let's enjoy some good news every now and then..
11-12-2016, 10:02 PM
#35
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 90
True.....everyone has a back story and we do get tired of hearing it in the industry or life for that matter. Sideshow will have to address that on his own; including the probationary comments.
11-12-2016, 10:23 PM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: MD11 CPT
Posts: 1,077
At least now your being honest!
I am new and naive compared to some of the more seasoned resident experts such as yourself, your right and I completely bought into "100 IPA", "as long as it takes", and "taking care of our own" and "insert your slogan here". So please help me understand and comprehend some aspects that I still don't understand being new and all. After a decade of listening to the moral superiority demand that major changes to this contract were needed all the while slamming scabs and NURPS in the same breath, now I have to ask what did they do that was so horrible? After all they too did what was best for them, right? They didn't have a back-up plan either, right? That the world would have ended if they turned the job down, right? So seriously help me understand how we're so much better?
You still believe that if we had shown some spine and said no to selling out 250 of our brothers, that UPS would have let that $5.3 billion deal they were secretly waiting to close go up in smoke? Its doesn't matter now but I just your take on it!
And for the record we didn't just fly together, we lived together for my first two years here.
I am new and naive compared to some of the more seasoned resident experts such as yourself, your right and I completely bought into "100 IPA", "as long as it takes", and "taking care of our own" and "insert your slogan here". So please help me understand and comprehend some aspects that I still don't understand being new and all. After a decade of listening to the moral superiority demand that major changes to this contract were needed all the while slamming scabs and NURPS in the same breath, now I have to ask what did they do that was so horrible? After all they too did what was best for them, right? They didn't have a back-up plan either, right? That the world would have ended if they turned the job down, right? So seriously help me understand how we're so much better?
You still believe that if we had shown some spine and said no to selling out 250 of our brothers, that UPS would have let that $5.3 billion deal they were secretly waiting to close go up in smoke? Its doesn't matter now but I just your take on it!
And for the record we didn't just fly together, we lived together for my first two years here.
Since you keep saying you weren't aware of how close you came to the abyss years ago, I'll shine the light of reality on it...at your request I might add.
Rewind to almost a decade ago on a PVG layover, where we and other crews ended up at the go cart track...well, the bar with a go cart track. You got very, very competitive and belligerent...over a go cart race to the point where several others became concerned, and ****ed. Another captain there approached me who was in the IPA "newhire mentor" program, of which I was unaware of and noted that we were flying together and seemed to have a rapport. He went on to say that professional standards had received several reports that you were way out of line on the jet, and that some had circumvented IPA and gone to the company saying you needed to go. The company punted it back to the IPA. He asked me to have a heart to heart with you and I did. I told you the truth of the matter as told to me. You thanked me for it, and you're still here. That my friend is the unvarnished truth of the matter whether you choose to remember it or not.
There it is brother...you asked to hear it. Now it's your choice to listen or play the victim yet again. Your choice.
Yet again here we are...you give the impression that the union and the company are out to get you. You've said it on the B & G. You've said it here. It's as though you're saying you're surrounded by ***holes.
Seriously? I dunno brother, this clip comes to mind:
https://youtu.be/laFGAp6Ip40
Remember my friend...you're the one who started the direct personal accusations and labels on this thread.
11-12-2016, 10:32 PM
#37
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: On Food Stamps
Posts: 937
I never said I didn't take those two JAs, so honesty isn't an issue...with me at least. Now...let's test your honesty.
Since you keep saying you weren't aware of how close you came to the abyss years ago, I'll shine the light of reality on it...at your request I might add.
Rewind to almost a decade ago on a PVG layover, where we and other crews ended up at the go cart track...well, the bar with a go cart track. You got very, very competitive and belligerent...over a go cart race to the point where several others became concerned, and ****ed. Another captain there approached me who was in the IPA "newhire mentor" program, of which I was unaware of and noted that we were flying together and seemed to have a rapport. He went on to say that professional standards had received several reports that you were way out of line on the jet, and that some had circumvented IPA and gone to the company saying you needed to go. The company punted it back to the IPA. He asked me to have a heart to heart with you and I did. I told you the truth of the matter as told to me. You thanked me for it, and you're still here. That my friend is the unvarnished truth of the matter whether you choose to remember it or not.
There it is brother...you asked to hear it. Now it's your choice to listen or play the victim yet again. Your choice.
Yet again here we are...you give the impression that the union and the company are out to get you. You've said it on the B & G. You've said it here. It's as though you're saying you're surrounded by ***holes.
Seriously? I dunno brother, this clip comes to mind:
https://youtu.be/laFGAp6Ip40
Remember my friend...you're the one who started the direct personal accusations and labels on this thread.
Since you keep saying you weren't aware of how close you came to the abyss years ago, I'll shine the light of reality on it...at your request I might add.
Rewind to almost a decade ago on a PVG layover, where we and other crews ended up at the go cart track...well, the bar with a go cart track. You got very, very competitive and belligerent...over a go cart race to the point where several others became concerned, and ****ed. Another captain there approached me who was in the IPA "newhire mentor" program, of which I was unaware of and noted that we were flying together and seemed to have a rapport. He went on to say that professional standards had received several reports that you were way out of line on the jet, and that some had circumvented IPA and gone to the company saying you needed to go. The company punted it back to the IPA. He asked me to have a heart to heart with you and I did. I told you the truth of the matter as told to me. You thanked me for it, and you're still here. That my friend is the unvarnished truth of the matter whether you choose to remember it or not.
There it is brother...you asked to hear it. Now it's your choice to listen or play the victim yet again. Your choice.
Yet again here we are...you give the impression that the union and the company are out to get you. You've said it on the B & G. You've said it here. It's as though you're saying you're surrounded by ***holes.
Seriously? I dunno brother, this clip comes to mind:
https://youtu.be/laFGAp6Ip40
Remember my friend...you're the one who started the direct personal accusations and labels on this thread.
I started the labeling? I think you said something about the menopausal something or rather, you started it but you have a way of deflecting things and only seeing what you want to see!
Last edited by Shaggy1970; 11-12-2016 at 10:57 PM.
11-12-2016, 10:37 PM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,339
I'm not a moderator? Way above my pay grade... 
!!The easiest way would be for you to copy and paste your initial comment on the others thread and for those who replied to do the same. Eventually others will follow.
If there is a moderator here would you please do that if others don't object?
..and until then could everyone please reply to all questions or rebuttals unrelated to 300 new-hires on the other thread?
(I was hoping flyphisher would be the first one to do so..)
Again, here's the venting thread:
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/2242395-post1.html
Please keep this thread on topic "UPS to hire 300 in 2017".
11-12-2016, 10:41 PM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: MD11 CPT
Posts: 1,077
I remember everything about the PVG encounter, cause I was competitive at a Go kart track they wanted me fired? You told me to tone it down and I did, but being fired! Hearing and all other stuff is horse $ hit. I have had a few dealings with Pro Standards, but thats cause I don't take $ hit from anyone including you! So lets now get back to your JA pick up and answering my questions instead of deflecting the truth as so conveniently you tend to do! How about that sport!
I guess I'm the fool for that.
As for the JA, re-read what I wrote...it's middle school reading level, clear and concise.
I don't know what else to say at this point.
11-12-2016, 10:44 PM
#40
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: On Food Stamps
Posts: 937
Unbeknownst to me the wheels were already in motion WRT your conduct. Another captain at the track that night who was on the mentor committee approached me unsolicited. I personally never saw it when we flew together...I liked flying with you, and being in the same pad. I've defended you several times.
I guess I'm the fool for that.
As for the JA, re-read what I wrote...it's middle school reading level, clear and concise.
I don't know what else to say at this point.
I guess I'm the fool for that.
As for the JA, re-read what I wrote...it's middle school reading level, clear and concise.
I don't know what else to say at this point.
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