SpecialTracking

So under the greatest time of prosperity in the history of the airline industry I ask if not now, when is there a better time to negotiate?

Keep in mind, we have something the company wants with airplanes ordered. Something that caused the company to approach us. Delta already gave up that leverage.

If not now, when?

ron kent

For the no voters that haven't figured it out yet, the extension is the leverage. The company has no intention of signing a new deal with pilots for at least 3 years. They are paying for peace and breathing room from the pilots while they deal with all the other issues they have facing them, IT, FA/Mechanic contracts, etc. I tried to point this out a few weeks ago on the other forum but that is crazy talk over there.

We turn this deal down and the leverage is gone. But we will be able to be ****ed off for the next three years, put our hats on and march around and inflate some giant rats.

Grumble

The 500 was on property only a 2-3 years ago, several other airplanes on there are not and won't be here either yet we compare ourselves to them all the time (Dal 717 rates for instance). Make the capt rates, highest FO rate + some, I'll loose some of my heart burn over it.

UAL can buy these airplanes whenever they like, they don't need this TA to do it. Voting yes because you think the content of the TA is better than what we could do in Sec 6, not because of speculation and hope. Hope isn't a strategy, like hoping DAL ratifies before 1/2018.

So with all that leverage, we got 13%... That's what you're saying right?

SpecialTracking

While I agree that the company would like peace and a known cost structure going forward, how do you know they have every intention of delaying a contract for three years? Wadr this is the mentality that has been laid upon us over the last 13 years and if we continue with this train of thought, our future contracts will go nowhere.

Andy

You want Capt rates higher than which FO rate? A350? 747? 737-500? How about the current CRJ900 Capt rates? Are those OK to be below current 737-500FO rates? Because they're $3/hr lower at the 12 year point.

Let's step back for a moment and ask a really important question here. Is there any scenario where you envision yourself flying a CS-100?

I'd love to say that I don't see any scenario, but all it would take for me to either be furloughed again or flying a CS-100 is another age change to 70 combined with an economic downturn. Having been through that twice, I'd prefer to be flying a NSNB jet with mainline instead of on the street again looking for a job.

So to me, it's not only about whether this TA is better than what we could do in Section 6, it is also a bit of insurance for those of us on the bottom third of the list. I don't view the CS-100 pay rates as B Scale or even concessionary.

I am also very concerned about the continual mainline retreat from flying smaller equipment. We need to stop this by getting a NSNB on property. If the pay rates are out of line on the CS-100, EMB190, ERJ900 or whatever NSNB is chosen, we can get them fixed. But fumbling the opportunity to capture some small gauge flying on mainline because the pay's too low on one airframe that's not on property is shortsighted and I suspect that most of us on the bottom third of the list feel the same way. For some of us, it's not a comparison of retired 737-500 rates to CS-100 rates; it's a comparison of mainline CS-100 rates to starting regional wages.

UALinIAH

How about run the math against other contracts?

American 1/16 pay rate for group 1 (CS series and EMBs) $153/hr
New TA for same a/c $185

Just saying, nothing "B" about that scale. And don't forget AMR gets 0 for PS either.

ron kent

Nobody knows anything about the future, you may be willing to bet $120,000+ on an unknown, I am not.

SpecialTracking

It's worth a lot more than that over the course of the next two contracts.

Dave Fitzgerald

It's all well and good to want RJ rates commensurate with our pay scales, but, and I really don't know, I'm asking, how does the CS100 rate in the TA compare to current Express rates?

That is the competition we will have in that segment. We have always said we wanted them on the property, now at what price?

gettinbumped

The CS100 rates absolutely murder any Express rate at any carrier for any plane. By like $60 an hour.