Fixes to reserve
12-07-2016, 05:07 AM
#261
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: 737 CA
Posts: 2,750
Sled,
What's the point of revisiting this old dead thread now? Has gloating suddenly come into vogue?
From Google:
Gloating - to contemplate or dwell on one's own success or another's misfortune with smugness or malignant pleasure.
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...F-8#q=gloating
20-25 percent of 11500 is a big number. There are a lot of guys on reserve and from what I read, not all are giddy. In fact, take a look at DCA 777 next month. The G line just jumped by 40 - 50 guys. That will put a lot of guys on SC who have been solid line holders for years. Many of them don't live anywhere near DC, so please spare us the "you bid it" argument. Twenty bucks says the number of PDR's from DC pilots jumps next month. While I'm glad its working well for YOU, that's not my idea of being a union member. What's next, sweet deals from Scheduling for flying over vacation?
As ST said, I'm having a tough time recognizing this new version of United Airlines.
What's the point of revisiting this old dead thread now? Has gloating suddenly come into vogue?
From Google:
Gloating - to contemplate or dwell on one's own success or another's misfortune with smugness or malignant pleasure.
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...F-8#q=gloating
20-25 percent of 11500 is a big number. There are a lot of guys on reserve and from what I read, not all are giddy. In fact, take a look at DCA 777 next month. The G line just jumped by 40 - 50 guys. That will put a lot of guys on SC who have been solid line holders for years. Many of them don't live anywhere near DC, so please spare us the "you bid it" argument. Twenty bucks says the number of PDR's from DC pilots jumps next month. While I'm glad its working well for YOU, that's not my idea of being a union member. What's next, sweet deals from Scheduling for flying over vacation?
As ST said, I'm having a tough time recognizing this new version of United Airlines.
I have over 350...but I did a couple of lineholder months. Keep up the good work, sir.
12-07-2016, 05:45 AM
#263
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: 767/757 CA
Posts: 2,701
Sled,
What's the point of revisiting this old dead thread now? Has gloating suddenly come into vogue?
From Google:
Gloating - to contemplate or dwell on one's own success or another's misfortune with smugness or malignant pleasure.
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...F-8#q=gloating
20-25 percent of 11500 is a big number. There are a lot of guys on reserve and from what I read, not all are giddy. In fact, take a look at DCA 777 next month. The G line just jumped by 40 - 50 guys. That will put a lot of guys on SC who have been solid line holders for years. Many of them don't live anywhere near DC, so please spare us the "you bid it" argument. Twenty bucks says the number of PDR's from DC pilots jumps next month. While I'm glad its working well for YOU, that's not my idea of being a union member. What's next, sweet deals from Scheduling for flying over vacation?
As ST said, I'm having a tough time recognizing this new version of United Airlines.
What's the point of revisiting this old dead thread now? Has gloating suddenly come into vogue?
From Google:
Gloating - to contemplate or dwell on one's own success or another's misfortune with smugness or malignant pleasure.
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...F-8#q=gloating
20-25 percent of 11500 is a big number. There are a lot of guys on reserve and from what I read, not all are giddy. In fact, take a look at DCA 777 next month. The G line just jumped by 40 - 50 guys. That will put a lot of guys on SC who have been solid line holders for years. Many of them don't live anywhere near DC, so please spare us the "you bid it" argument. Twenty bucks says the number of PDR's from DC pilots jumps next month. While I'm glad its working well for YOU, that's not my idea of being a union member. What's next, sweet deals from Scheduling for flying over vacation?
As ST said, I'm having a tough time recognizing this new version of United Airlines.
12-07-2016, 06:34 AM
#264
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Position: The GF of FUPM
Posts: 3,073
Sled,
Your seat in domicile is and has been overstaffed for some time. As a result, guys in your seat, who live close to the airport are having a pretty sweet life. Congrats.
Guys who commute to reserve, either by choice or by force aren't nearly as enamored with the current SC situation. I suspect that a bunch of the 50 some guys in DC who will suddenly appear on the reserve list next month will have significant issues with SC and FIFO. Every and every month there's at least one thread on the other forum detailing some of the more fecal elements of our current reserve system and potential solutions.
The contract has holes in it. I'd like to see them fixed, even those holes which do not, and will never affect ME. That's what I mean.
Your seat in domicile is and has been overstaffed for some time. As a result, guys in your seat, who live close to the airport are having a pretty sweet life. Congrats.
Guys who commute to reserve, either by choice or by force aren't nearly as enamored with the current SC situation. I suspect that a bunch of the 50 some guys in DC who will suddenly appear on the reserve list next month will have significant issues with SC and FIFO. Every and every month there's at least one thread on the other forum detailing some of the more fecal elements of our current reserve system and potential solutions.
The contract has holes in it. I'd like to see them fixed, even those holes which do not, and will never affect ME. That's what I mean.
12-07-2016, 07:13 AM
#265
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: 747 Captain, retired
Posts: 928
The 10 am first day show was never negotiated, but a by product of our current contract, plus 117. It is very expensive for the company. It is just sheer, dumb luck that we have it.
The "fix" to reserve will probably be that this goes away in the next contract, as we are unwilling to spend the capital to keep it. The current contract extension keeps all the bennies of the current system, including the 10 am show on the first day.
I bid reserve about half the time, and fly with reserves about 1/3 of the time. The only pilots I hear complaining about reserve are on this board. The last one I flew with that complained about our system was back in 07 or so.
Hopefully no changes to reserve. Any change, will probably be for the worse.
The "fix" to reserve will probably be that this goes away in the next contract, as we are unwilling to spend the capital to keep it. The current contract extension keeps all the bennies of the current system, including the 10 am show on the first day.
I bid reserve about half the time, and fly with reserves about 1/3 of the time. The only pilots I hear complaining about reserve are on this board. The last one I flew with that complained about our system was back in 07 or so.
Hopefully no changes to reserve. Any change, will probably be for the worse.
In short, these SC assignments are convenient for the Crewdesk and a major hassel for reserves who live out of base.
My recommendation is to throw the SC assignments for the month in the trip bucket and let reserves bid on them before the month starts. That way they will know when they need to be available and can reserve Hotel rooms in advance.
12-07-2016, 07:19 AM
#266
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: B737 Captain
Posts: 111
This is a great idea. SC has morphed into a panic button for CS. How is this not win/win for RSV holders who both live in base AND out of base?
12-07-2016, 08:56 AM
#267
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: 787
Posts: 3,202
What has happened on the 777 fleet in DCA is just wrong. The company needs to keep the G-line percentages consistent to allow pilots the opportunity to bid fleets/seats that fit their lifestyle. What should have happened is more W flying to keep the number of block hours consistent during the Winter drawdown and add G-Line stability.
The W flying you want would put line holders in other bases on RSV.
Bottom line is don't chase flying. Bid an aircraft and seat you want and accept the fact that the flying will change with the seasons.
12-07-2016, 12:26 PM
#268
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: 747 Captain, retired
Posts: 928
Our current reserve rules are not that bad and actually quite livable. The problem is the crew desk and their managers. They bastardize the language and find every loophole they can. Every time I think they are screwing me I learn that they are actually in the right, this leads me to believe that you are actually theirs 24/7. The Reserve rules don't need to be fixed, the language needs to be fixed.
Examples:
1. If notified of a SC at 2359 you need 12hrs, if notified at 0000 you need 10 hrs. Scheduling has done this to me numerous times. They build a 10am SC and wait tell midnight to assign it.
2. Any SC built within 15 hours of call time is immediately assignable. they wait tell the evening then build several SC times and assign them immediately. There is no transparency. If I would have known they were going to build a 0200 SC I would have picked up the 1400 SC that was built before 10am. It also removes pilots that WANT to pick up a SC from the list.
3. You can only sit 1 RSV period a day. Thats great but the company keeps you on the hook until 2359 then releases you for the day 1 minute before midnight then assigns you a SC/FSB for the next day. If you are on a SC assignment you can not Aggressive pickup without the required rest, (hard to get when your 14hrs ends at 5am). Again you have no control over your life, you end up being the crew desks ***** because you can't break the SC cycle.
4. There is no consistency with SC and FSB assignments. How can a Wednesday with perfect weather need 12 SCs and 2 FSB, then a Saturday with garbage weather get 1 SC? If scheduling needs a reserve to start every hour then they should make that the standard everyday and staff the base accordingly. Reserves should be able to look at the FIFO list and see where exactly they fall based on the required pilots needed for the day. This allows RSV to either pickup a trip, pick a SC that suits their needs best and plan their commute.
5. This one I just learned about yesterday, if you are going from RSV to line holder they can roll your days into you line month, even for a basic trip. Reason being is because line holders do not have RDOs and HDOs. So the section of the contract that states that you can only have RDOs rolled for a global trip does not apply. WHAT?????? Talk about a load of ****.
6. Scheduling doesn't look ahead at tomorrow, this is nothing new, However, getting rolled into your days off because they put 13 people on SC yesterday and now they are all illegal is not right.
Anyways I'v decided I'm done commuting and I am moving to base. However, I would still like to have control over my life and will most likely be voting no on this TA based on the lack of RSV fixes.
Examples:
1. If notified of a SC at 2359 you need 12hrs, if notified at 0000 you need 10 hrs. Scheduling has done this to me numerous times. They build a 10am SC and wait tell midnight to assign it.
2. Any SC built within 15 hours of call time is immediately assignable. they wait tell the evening then build several SC times and assign them immediately. There is no transparency. If I would have known they were going to build a 0200 SC I would have picked up the 1400 SC that was built before 10am. It also removes pilots that WANT to pick up a SC from the list.
3. You can only sit 1 RSV period a day. Thats great but the company keeps you on the hook until 2359 then releases you for the day 1 minute before midnight then assigns you a SC/FSB for the next day. If you are on a SC assignment you can not Aggressive pickup without the required rest, (hard to get when your 14hrs ends at 5am). Again you have no control over your life, you end up being the crew desks ***** because you can't break the SC cycle.
4. There is no consistency with SC and FSB assignments. How can a Wednesday with perfect weather need 12 SCs and 2 FSB, then a Saturday with garbage weather get 1 SC? If scheduling needs a reserve to start every hour then they should make that the standard everyday and staff the base accordingly. Reserves should be able to look at the FIFO list and see where exactly they fall based on the required pilots needed for the day. This allows RSV to either pickup a trip, pick a SC that suits their needs best and plan their commute.
5. This one I just learned about yesterday, if you are going from RSV to line holder they can roll your days into you line month, even for a basic trip. Reason being is because line holders do not have RDOs and HDOs. So the section of the contract that states that you can only have RDOs rolled for a global trip does not apply. WHAT?????? Talk about a load of ****.
6. Scheduling doesn't look ahead at tomorrow, this is nothing new, However, getting rolled into your days off because they put 13 people on SC yesterday and now they are all illegal is not right.
Anyways I'v decided I'm done commuting and I am moving to base. However, I would still like to have control over my life and will most likely be voting no on this TA based on the lack of RSV fixes.
12-07-2016, 03:18 PM
#269
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,866
"Wash out your Head Gear New Guy" (Full Metal Jacket). What reserves need is an independent audit of Short-Call Assignments built by the Crewdesk. The purpose of which is to identify the reason for the Short-Call assignments. Here's what I see and I see it a lot - Four reserves available and 3 are put on Short-call. I believe the crewdesk assigns crews to SC because at least these SC Pilots do not need 10 -12 hours notice for an assignment. It's easier to make a call to a SC and release them for duty and assigning a trip for the next morning. Here's another example; the last flight of the day for the 747 out of SFO is the Afternoon Frankfurt (departure time is about 1400) yet they continue to assign 1400 and 1500 SC assignments.
In short, these SC assignments are convenient for the Crewdesk and a major hassel for reserves who live out of base.
My recommendation is to throw the SC assignments for the month in the trip bucket and let reserves bid on them before the month starts. That way they will know when they need to be available and can reserve Hotel rooms in advance.
In short, these SC assignments are convenient for the Crewdesk and a major hassel for reserves who live out of base.
My recommendation is to throw the SC assignments for the month in the trip bucket and let reserves bid on them before the month starts. That way they will know when they need to be available and can reserve Hotel rooms in advance.
Most SC assignments are not for short callouts. As you say, they're just a modified long callout except they gain two hours on the callout--12 hours to 10 hours. It's a twofer--2 1/2 hour to show or roll to FAR rest to a 10 hour to show. How could they not put everyone on SC with that kind of rule. The negotiators put what they thought would be a deterrent to this by having them pay for extra SCs but this turns out to not even be a speed bump.
Last edited by APC225; 12-07-2016 at 03:44 PM.
12-07-2016, 04:25 PM
#270
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B-787 Captain
Posts: 183
Let us think outside the traditional union reserve section of the contract (actually just burn it.)
KISS..... 1 page for the entire reserve section.
1. Everyone is a line holder and everyone gets a line of time.
2. A day of reserve pays a minimum of 5 hours or flight time whatever is greater.
3. Scheduling makes 1,2,3,4,5,or 6 day reserve pairings and are bid in PBS as a normal pairing.
4. Schedules are made to a minimum 75 hours of pay. If all you got were reserve pairings, you would only be working 15 days.
5. Just as a regular pairing, on reserve pairing the company pays for your hotel at your Base if you want it.
6. Unlimited trades, pick-ups, and drops of your assignments.
7. Scheduling can build additional reserve pairing as required to keep the airplanes flying. Anyone can pick them up.
8. No SC's or LCR's. You need to report to the airport in 2:30 if needed when on reserve. Like SC's you'll probably never be used. Why you ask????
9. Open trips within 24 hours of departure time pays 200% premium pay. Someone will fly the trip.
What's wrong with this concept? The company would save money and the constant drama for the pilots would be reduced.
Work Hard Fly Right!
KISS..... 1 page for the entire reserve section.
1. Everyone is a line holder and everyone gets a line of time.
2. A day of reserve pays a minimum of 5 hours or flight time whatever is greater.
3. Scheduling makes 1,2,3,4,5,or 6 day reserve pairings and are bid in PBS as a normal pairing.
4. Schedules are made to a minimum 75 hours of pay. If all you got were reserve pairings, you would only be working 15 days.
5. Just as a regular pairing, on reserve pairing the company pays for your hotel at your Base if you want it.
6. Unlimited trades, pick-ups, and drops of your assignments.
7. Scheduling can build additional reserve pairing as required to keep the airplanes flying. Anyone can pick them up.
8. No SC's or LCR's. You need to report to the airport in 2:30 if needed when on reserve. Like SC's you'll probably never be used. Why you ask????
9. Open trips within 24 hours of departure time pays 200% premium pay. Someone will fly the trip.
What's wrong with this concept? The company would save money and the constant drama for the pilots would be reduced.
Work Hard Fly Right!
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