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12-28-2014, 12:53 PM

#71

AV82SKI

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Joined APC: Apr 2013

Posts: 65

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Fitzgerald

Huhhggmm....(throat clearing).....have you any kind of idea what we get vs. Delta on profit sharing?

Sorry dude, we lag Delta by a lot. And, 757 pays the same a the guppy. That's embarrassing.

The conversation is about pay rates only. Delta might get a larger pool percentage this year than us but once again their profits dwarf the UAL profit. For all I know their distribution pool is 10% as well.

I have no idea about TOTAL compensation vs Delta but keep in mind we were getting 2% more in our defined benefit vs Delta for the last two years. It doesn't really ease the fact that we lagged Delta by 8.5% in 2012 and by 3% in 2013 & 2014.

I could vote no easily on the TA based on the 757/767 pay rate alone. It was sad to see pilots accept 8.5% less than Delta as well the first year. Unfortunately, 67% said it was "good enough" for them. Now we live with the results.

12-28-2014, 01:11 PM

#72

Knotcher

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Joined APC: Sep 2012

Posts: 511

Quote:

Originally Posted by XHooker

Why? It's the replacement for the 757.

..and has just as many seats, guzzles less gas, has a lower CASM and more profitable on the same routes. Ego is the only explanation I can think of...

12-28-2014, 01:18 PM

#73

oldmako

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Position: The GF of FUPM

Posts: 3,073

That's a tad facile, isn't it?

12-28-2014, 01:25 PM

#74

pilot64golfer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by AV82SKI

The conversation is about pay rates only. .

Which are misleading in themselves. If you have better work rules, you get paid more hours for the same flying. So you can have a more generous contract and actually put more money in the bank with a lower hourly rate because you get paid more total hours (soft time etc) than a DAL pilot flying the same trip.

I don't know exactly what their work rules are, but obviously its not about just one aspect of compensation its about the total pay, etc.

12-28-2014, 10:37 PM

#75

Dave Fitzgerald

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Joined APC: Mar 2012

Position: 777

Posts: 2,173

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knotcher

..and has just as many seats, guzzles less gas, has a lower CASM and more profitable on the same routes. Ego is the only explanation I can think of...

Not really worth debating. You go ahead and keep right on believing that.

12-29-2014, 04:59 AM

#76

SpecialTracking

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Joined APC: Nov 2010

Posts: 3,071

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knotcher

..and has just as many seats, guzzles less gas, has a lower CASM and more profitable on the same routes. Ego is the only explanation I can think of...

Some speak with experience and fact while others speak with .......

12-29-2014, 09:02 AM

#77

Knotcher

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Joined APC: Sep 2012

Posts: 511

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Fitzgerald

Not really worth debating. You go ahead and keep right on believing that.

Not worth debating = can't debate because facts not on my side

Again, same number of passengers and burns less fuel using a lighter airframe. Try to refute that, just more comic relief for the rest of us.

12-29-2014, 09:24 AM

#78

pilot64golfer

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Posts: 1,168

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knotcher

So you compare number of passengers because it suits you in this example, but the scabliner holds about 150 people less (a full guppy) than a 747 yet they pay the same! Using this logic a 747 should pay scabliner plus guppy pay.

Also its about performance, not just number of passengers. The guppy is fine for short-haul flying, but I don't see guppies flying to Europe.

12-29-2014, 09:39 AM

#79

CousinEddie

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Joined APC: Nov 2012

Posts: 1,085

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knotcher

I'll agree with you here. Watch the iPad video where Brian Znotins addresses this topic in detail. If the super guppy with all things considered ultimately brings more to the bottom line, so be it. We don't seem to be the only airline that has come to the same financial conclusion.

12-29-2014, 05:25 PM

#80

intrepidcv11

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Joined APC: Sep 2010

Posts: 1,253

Quote:

Originally Posted by CousinEddie

Thank the freaking almighty, somebody gets it. Funny thing is outside of a few airline pilot forums, most UAL guys I know really could care less about the super guppy downgrade given that the pay/schedule is right. Hence why TK South is currently packed with UAL upgrades.