CAL Junior Captains vs UAL
09-11-2013, 02:02 PM
#11
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Joined APC: May 2010
Position: Left - Dodge Caravan
Posts: 357
I have been looking at the staffing and it appears that the most junior captain at UAL is around 50% total company seniority. It appears from this that the trend to upgrade as soon as possible is far greater at United than it was at CAL.
A lot of talk on here has been about how junior the captains were at CAL. This was primarily because our FO's tended to be extremely senior and avoided the captain bids for QOL. We see almost as many FO's retire off the 777 as Captains. In fact right now someone I know who is 32% in the company is holding #83 in Newark on the 777 (about 22%). He can easily hold Captain in any A320 base as a line holder using the current list.
The idea that all the UAL guys will flow into the Captain slots at CAL is probably very true. But, I think a lot of people are forgetting that a TON of our very senior people commute from the West Coast, Denver and even a bunch from MSP and ORD. These folks are very senior yet have chosen to not commute to a domestic line in ORD, LAX, SFO or DEN until post ISL as the small number of flights made the schedule's very poor.
Now that the ISL is done and the Airbus is open to bidding by both sides (as there are openings), I would expect some of our most senior guys (top 20%) to bid home to the West coast and Denver. We have had such poor bases for so long that the idea these guys can fly from home is very exciting. It will be interesting to see how many CAL guys flow on to the Bus.
A lot of talk on here has been about how junior the captains were at CAL. This was primarily because our FO's tended to be extremely senior and avoided the captain bids for QOL. We see almost as many FO's retire off the 777 as Captains. In fact right now someone I know who is 32% in the company is holding #83 in Newark on the 777 (about 22%). He can easily hold Captain in any A320 base as a line holder using the current list.
The idea that all the UAL guys will flow into the Captain slots at CAL is probably very true. But, I think a lot of people are forgetting that a TON of our very senior people commute from the West Coast, Denver and even a bunch from MSP and ORD. These folks are very senior yet have chosen to not commute to a domestic line in ORD, LAX, SFO or DEN until post ISL as the small number of flights made the schedule's very poor.
Now that the ISL is done and the Airbus is open to bidding by both sides (as there are openings), I would expect some of our most senior guys (top 20%) to bid home to the West coast and Denver. We have had such poor bases for so long that the idea these guys can fly from home is very exciting. It will be interesting to see how many CAL guys flow on to the Bus.
This was not the case 12 Years ago.
With the 2 1/2 year upgrades and UAL pilots confident of the opportunity to bid CA, the list went EXTREMELY junior on a relative seniority bases.
When the cut backs came following 9-11 the lists were all compressed and the CA seats went much higher. The second round of cuts in 2008 made it even worse. With no retirements from that point on and the 737 parking, there were almost zero chances to bid NB CA.
After the post ISL seat and base shuffle is over for there will once again likely be very junior CA bids again.
SP
09-11-2013, 04:12 PM
#12
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Joined APC: Aug 2013
Position: non reclining seat
Posts: 447
Basically stagnant United guys saw Continental guys with relatively quick upgrade times and wanted what they didn't have.
That about sums it up in my book. Enjoy your upgrade but buy the first round at least.
That about sums it up in my book. Enjoy your upgrade but buy the first round at least.
09-11-2013, 04:47 PM
#13
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Joined APC: Sep 2013
Posts: 940
The Captain (regardless of seniority, DOH, DOB, Hair color, etc) must buy the first round, At least!!!!
Probationary pilots don't pay for ****!
On my first trip (a 3 day) I drank and ate so much I could hardly function. When I got home, I had spent $4. $1 tip each way to the van driver at the 2 hotels.
Pay it forward (or downward, or whatever direction that would be)
09-11-2013, 04:52 PM
#14
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Position: B756
Posts: 82
Couldn't agree more...but moving on. Looking forward to flying with the UAL guys and putting this whole SLI fiasco behind.
09-11-2013, 04:53 PM
#15
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Cap
Posts: 2,282
But the drinks and more are definitely on me
09-11-2013, 04:58 PM
#16
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Joined APC: Aug 2013
Position: non reclining seat
Posts: 447
Alright I could have worded it a bit different but we all can agree on one thing. Captain buys first round!!
We at last have agreed on something..That is a start..Hopefully to a few rounds.
Bottoms Up!
We at last have agreed on something..That is a start..Hopefully to a few rounds.
Bottoms Up!
09-11-2013, 05:13 PM
#17
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Joined APC: May 2009
Position: The GF of FUPM
Posts: 3,073
Interesting take on the events of the last few years. Your book must be very thin.
09-11-2013, 06:00 PM
#19
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Cap
Posts: 2,282
09-11-2013, 08:54 PM
#20
Line Holder
Joined APC: Mar 2013
Position: 737 CA
Posts: 39
Also, I looked up the info and the junior Capt on the A320 is In DCA and his old seniority number was 4157. There were 7565 on our seniority list, but as I am sure you are aware, many have been recalled as 737 F/O's.
So, if you include all the pilots on our list, the junior CAP would be a 55%.
However, the junior pilot actually on the UA side for bidding purposes was old seniority number 6572. So, if you only include those pilots actually on the UA bidding side, the junior CAP would be 63% down the list.
So, if you include all the pilots on our list, the junior CAP would be a 55%.
However, the junior pilot actually on the UA side for bidding purposes was old seniority number 6572. So, if you only include those pilots actually on the UA bidding side, the junior CAP would be 63% down the list.
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