Yak02

Early 1987

slammer1906

You guys are big kids...haha

cgull

you have what is called cognitive dissonance.What you are seeing is real. Its just that what you are seeing is being paid for by Legacy United Airlines because CAL was about to go bankrupt with its non-cancelable aircraft order, 2.1-2.4 billion in Bullet Loan payments coming due in 2010/11 and the balance of 5-6 billion in 12 13 and 14. CAL was running into a liquidity crunch from their aircraft purchase, Bullet Loans, the Great Recession, frozen captial markets, heavy CapEx, Credit Card agreement Default, etc.

CAL did the same thing in the early 90's too just like Harding Lawrence did with Braniff. CAL got Buthune in and he saved the day when he went back to keep CAL out of their 3rd bankruptcy by getting Boeing to give back the deposit money so that they would have enough cash to operate. This time the Banksters plan was to get United to come in and bail out CAL vice going into chapter 11. There were only a few airlines that could have survived the decade unscathed and CAL was not one of them. CAL had way too much debt like most of the Ponzi Scheme structured airlines in the USA. CAL is/was not a financially sound airline like Southwest Airlines (and neither is UAL).

Craig

Maxepr1

That all you got special? It's getting a little old.... You back at work yet on the United side?

Maxepr1

Craig Get over it the two companies merged... To bad so sad... If it makes you feel better keep on saying what your saying, I guess it will lessen your great emotional impact... I personally wished US Air was part of your equation. Funny how you guys never admit to anything, Arrogance abounds with sUAL at least with the members on this board anyway, Special leading the charge..My guess is your side will use the poor me approach during your side of the hearings as they have done through out this merger process. Sorry cgull the sympathy has ended....

ewrbasedpilot

From a previous thread.........................

From the latest 8-K


Item 2.01 Completion of Acquisition or Disposition of Assets.

Effective March 31, 2013, pursuant to the Merger Agreement, United merged with and into Continental, with Continental continuing as the surviving corporation of the Merger and changing its name to "United Airlines, Inc." In accordance with the Merger Agreement, at the effective time of the Merger, each outstanding share of United common stock immediately prior to the Merger was cancelled and retired and no consideration was delivered in exchange therefor. Each outstanding share of Continental common stock immediately prior to the Merger remained outstanding and was unaffected by the Merger.




On March 28, 2013, Continental Airlines, Inc., a Delaware corporation ("Continental") and a wholly-owned subsidiary of United Continental Holdings, Inc. ("UAL"), and United Air Lines, Inc., a Delaware corporation ("United") and a wholly-owned subsidiary of UAL, entered into an Agreement and Plan of Merger (the "Merger Agreement") providing for the merger of United with and into Continental (the "Merger"). On March 31, 2013, United merged with and into Continental, with Continental continuing as the surviving corporation of the Merger and as a wholly-owned subsidiary of UAL. Upon the closing of the Merger on March 31, 2013, Continental's name was changed to "United Airlines, Inc." (the "Survivor").

ewrbasedpilot

I do find it interesting that the incredible UAL was downsizing, furloughing, and pretty much anything else it could do to make itself "attractive" for a merger. Why would such a powerful, cash loaded, wonderful airline have to do things like that if things were so great as many say on here?

Probe

I am l-UAL currently on the l-CAL side. The l-CAL side that I have met mostly offered up (I didn't ask) about what SunVox estimated. Their careers stay the same, as do mine.

The bottom 25-30% of both lists probably don't agree.

I hope that in the end they both feel only slightly screwed.

Sunvox

Craig,

This is fascinating new logic to me. I had ignored the orders issue because it had been my understanding that financing, although not in hand, would inevitably be available when needed, but when you factor in United's merging with another airline, the spike in oil prices in '08, the economic recession of '09 then suddenly it becomes clear that if CAL did not merge with UAL they would not only have been struggling against 3 mega-carriers alone, they might have had an immediate and severe cash shortage that forced them into bankruptcy.

Wow! And, I thought the mega-carrier paradigm shift alone was a strong argument.

To my CAL brothers, it may be that I am wearing rose colored glasses and we will all see who is right later this year, but I gotta say it's looking very favorable for the UAL argument on all 3 factors which shall be considered. In the end though I still believe the only change or difference this creates is in the treatment of the furloughed pilots. It bolsters the argument that they had a strong future with a mega-carrier, and junior CAL pilots did not. I do not believe it shifts the top two thirds of the ISL in any meaningful way.

Good stuff Craig. Sorry I missed it when you first posted it.


Joe

Sunvox

I could be very wrong, but I do not believe any pilot from United would tell you that "things were great". What I do think every pilot at United has issue with is when CAL pilots argue that their company was doing leaps and bounds better than United and therefore they had a bright future while United pilots had no future at all. On that point I disagree completely, and I believe it is that debate which the arbitration panel will seek to illuminate, but I'm no lawyer, and it's all a big guess on my part.