UAL offer street hires classes?
04-30-2013, 10:13 AM
#771
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Position: 320 Captain
Posts: 659
OK, but you said 4-5 days at home, so I took that as 4-5 days off.
04-30-2013, 10:17 AM
#772
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Position: 320 Captain
Posts: 659
Not on the UAL side. the min days off called for contractually still apply. So since the JCBA now says one can waive the PBS build of 12 days down to 10 once the month begins, to me means 10 is the new minimum days off allowed. Not down to the FAR's (1 off in 7). OR if on a partial month can reduce the minimum days off prorated by up to 2.
04-30-2013, 11:23 AM
#774
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,639
FYI, UPA LOA 26 (topic 28) states that 5-E-4 (Scheduled Lineholder Minimum Days Off) is implemented with the third full Bid Period after effective date (i.e. March 2013).
So going forward it's 12 days off for line construction but the pilot may trade down to 10 days off if no pilots are on involuntary furlough. If crew scheduling is assigning or permitting pilots to drop below minimum this is something that the grievance folks need to know.
So going forward it's 12 days off for line construction but the pilot may trade down to 10 days off if no pilots are on involuntary furlough. If crew scheduling is assigning or permitting pilots to drop below minimum this is something that the grievance folks need to know.
04-30-2013, 12:49 PM
#775
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 880
Your confusing apples to oranges. Read what you posted again and understand it. Line construction is limited to no less than 12 off when building a line in PBS and once the award is posted. It protects us from PBS And the company from jamming a bad line down our throats and if PBS screws up and give less than 12. PBS is days off and line credit range limited unless
You waive credit or days off. Once I get my awarded and legal line I can choose to fly more on my days off and go well below the 12/10 as long as I am legal. It is that simple for the second time. You can easily turn a 12 days off a month worth 81 hrs (junior line) and give up four days off to make over 100 hrs, to not include DH. So 8 days off and 100+ hrs if I want to chase the Benjamin's. Nothing related to PBS and line construction.
You waive credit or days off. Once I get my awarded and legal line I can choose to fly more on my days off and go well below the 12/10 as long as I am legal. It is that simple for the second time. You can easily turn a 12 days off a month worth 81 hrs (junior line) and give up four days off to make over 100 hrs, to not include DH. So 8 days off and 100+ hrs if I want to chase the Benjamin's. Nothing related to PBS and line construction.
04-30-2013, 01:17 PM
#776
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2012
Position: 777
Posts: 2,171
Trip trade system basically does not work on the UAL side, at least for the 757's. Up till now the trip trade system won't allow less than 12 days off. I have yet to see if they will change the system for the 10 days off.
The crew desk is not supposed to allow trading outside this system but it still does happen. This is of course not including special people with crew desk deals. I think even jr/sr manning, they still have to repair the line to 12 days off.
Not sure if or when they will change it into the future--however we seem to still have pilots on involuntary furlough..
The crew desk is not supposed to allow trading outside this system but it still does happen. This is of course not including special people with crew desk deals. I think even jr/sr manning, they still have to repair the line to 12 days off.
Not sure if or when they will change it into the future--however we seem to still have pilots on involuntary furlough..
04-30-2013, 01:18 PM
#777
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,639
Your confusing apples to oranges. Read what you posted again and understand it. Line construction is limited to no less than 12 off when building a line in PBS and once the award is posted. It protects us from PBS And the company from jamming a bad line down our throats and if PBS screws up and give less than 12. PBS is days off and line credit range limited unless
You waive credit or days off. Once I get my awarded and legal line I can choose to fly more on my days off and go well below the 12/10 as long as I am legal. It is that simple for the second time. You can easily turn a 12 days off a month worth 81 hrs (junior line) and give up four days off to make over 100 hrs, to not include DH. So 8 days off and 100+ hrs if I want to chase the Benjamin's. Nothing related to PBS and line construction.
You waive credit or days off. Once I get my awarded and legal line I can choose to fly more on my days off and go well below the 12/10 as long as I am legal. It is that simple for the second time. You can easily turn a 12 days off a month worth 81 hrs (junior line) and give up four days off to make over 100 hrs, to not include DH. So 8 days off and 100+ hrs if I want to chase the Benjamin's. Nothing related to PBS and line construction.
We are in agreement that most of 5-E-4 (a,b,c) deals with line construction and requires 12 days off or the equivalent pro-rated for a partial month.
But then.....
5-E-4-d After Monthly Schedule Preferencing, if no pilots are on Involuntary Furlough, a Lineholder may reduce his minimum number of days off provided in Section 5-E-4-a or 5-E- 4-b, as applicable, by up to two (2).
This is the potential 12-2=10 formula and occurs after a line is built (i.e. trip trading). Note that in the UPA there are specific sections that a pilot may waive (easy examples: 5-C, 5-D) but there is no authority granted to waive 5-E.
Last edited by cadetdrivr; 04-30-2013 at 01:42 PM. Reason: typo
04-30-2013, 04:09 PM
#778
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Position: A320 Captain
Posts: 1,982
Your confusing apples to oranges. Read what you posted again and understand it. Line construction is limited to no less than 12 off when building a line in PBS and once the award is posted. It protects us from PBS And the company from jamming a bad line down our throats and if PBS screws up and give less than 12. PBS is days off and line credit range limited unless
You waive credit or days off. Once I get my awarded and legal line I can choose to fly more on my days off and go well below the 12/10 as long as I am legal. It is that simple for the second time. You can easily turn a 12 days off a month worth 81 hrs (junior line) and give up four days off to make over 100 hrs, to not include DH. So 8 days off and 100+ hrs if I want to chase the Benjamin's. Nothing related to PBS and line construction.
You waive credit or days off. Once I get my awarded and legal line I can choose to fly more on my days off and go well below the 12/10 as long as I am legal. It is that simple for the second time. You can easily turn a 12 days off a month worth 81 hrs (junior line) and give up four days off to make over 100 hrs, to not include DH. So 8 days off and 100+ hrs if I want to chase the Benjamin's. Nothing related to PBS and line construction.
The whoring will end at CMS. You will not be able to waive below 10 days. They should have put in a credit cap like they used to have.
04-30-2013, 06:41 PM
#779
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Position: 756 Left Side
Posts: 1,629
Alot of "rumors" going around of FO's making 20K a month, Captains making 55K in a month.
I have not met or seen one pilot (or paysheet) with those numbers.
Is it possible.. sure. However, when the Trip Trade window opened on the 21st, I asked about dropping a trip. Was told "You guys are below min coverage every day next month!"
So, the regular average line guy getting 12 days off a month will not have many opportunities to pick up a trip. Even if he did.. it may be a single trip at 200%. That does not add up to the figures people are throwing out there.
They only guys I see being able to really take advantage of this 150-200% are;
1) Mil drop guys who end up having the ability to pick something else up after dropping a trip.
2) Union Leave guys who may end up having their trips bought, and then have the ability to pick up trips after their union work is done.
3) Sick leave guys who end up being able to fly something after a few days of being down.. then feeling healthy enough to pick up a trip.
4) the few guys without a life that are able to pick up a trip on their days off and if it doesn't violate any FAR.
[I bring this point up as I've attempted to trade a 4 day BHX into a JFK pairing (I live local) but am unable due to the International (Global) pairing I've got a few days prior~]
Out of 4000 active pilots on the LCAL side, it wouldn't surprise me if maybe 40 are able to maximize their pay every month. That's 1%.
Does anyone from the other fleets/bases know if they have been able to pickup trips at 150-200%?
Guam?
LAX 73?
EWR 77 Capt?
Kudos to the handful that have been able to pull it off. They are using the contract to their advantage. Only negative side affect is going to be that most pilots who try to ADV a trip will probably not get any takers any more.. as the "smart" thing to do will be to hold out for the money~
Going to be a fun summer!
Motch
I have not met or seen one pilot (or paysheet) with those numbers.
Is it possible.. sure. However, when the Trip Trade window opened on the 21st, I asked about dropping a trip. Was told "You guys are below min coverage every day next month!"
So, the regular average line guy getting 12 days off a month will not have many opportunities to pick up a trip. Even if he did.. it may be a single trip at 200%. That does not add up to the figures people are throwing out there.
They only guys I see being able to really take advantage of this 150-200% are;
1) Mil drop guys who end up having the ability to pick something else up after dropping a trip.
2) Union Leave guys who may end up having their trips bought, and then have the ability to pick up trips after their union work is done.
3) Sick leave guys who end up being able to fly something after a few days of being down.. then feeling healthy enough to pick up a trip.
4) the few guys without a life that are able to pick up a trip on their days off and if it doesn't violate any FAR.
[I bring this point up as I've attempted to trade a 4 day BHX into a JFK pairing (I live local) but am unable due to the International (Global) pairing I've got a few days prior~]
Out of 4000 active pilots on the LCAL side, it wouldn't surprise me if maybe 40 are able to maximize their pay every month. That's 1%.
Does anyone from the other fleets/bases know if they have been able to pickup trips at 150-200%?
Guam?
LAX 73?
EWR 77 Capt?
Kudos to the handful that have been able to pull it off. They are using the contract to their advantage. Only negative side affect is going to be that most pilots who try to ADV a trip will probably not get any takers any more.. as the "smart" thing to do will be to hold out for the money~
Going to be a fun summer!
Motch
Learned that I can vol for JRM/SRM even if I have a trip in a day or two.. that scheduling will access the bad day/worse day and if I get it, I will be either pay protected for the trip I drop or get 150/200% for the one I pick up.
Only kicker is, if I were to pick up said trip, I would still be put on RX days for the remainder of the days from my original trip!
This is a good thing.. but again, it's gonna affect only a handful of guys who are lucky enough to have the ability to do this, are on a fleet/seat/base where they are offering this.. and as long as it doesn't break an FAR.
Motch
PS> Now I have to figure this one out-
you have a 3 day on Fri/Sat/Sun, worth 17:30
you JRM into a 3 day on Wed/Thrus/Fri, 16:00 credit.
JRM pays 24:00. But then you are on RX on Sat/Sun.
Do you get 4:03 per day for the two RX days on top of the 24:00?!
If so, you'd be looking at 32:06 for the 5 days, 34:00 if they actually used you on those two reserve days.
05-01-2013, 08:13 AM
#780
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Position: 320 Captain
Posts: 659
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