ALPA Resignation
 

I did. An LEC chairman. " It was the best we could do".

The best I can do us sue your a$$es and get you decertified.

Next.

47,

I understand that you are upset about this and I am too but "It was the best we could do". Is not the whole story and you know that.

It was the best they could do given the L-CAL insistence to "Stall over this issue for five years if needed". This is a product of the L-CAL MEc drawing a line in the sand that they were willing to fight to the "death" over. Draw your own conclusions on why the CAL MEc picked this issue as their Waterloo I am more than certain why they did and that they are friggin scum for doing it, however that is the here and now that we are dealing with. the CAL MEc position was NO as in one nada zippo furlough credit for UAL guys. These CAL MEc D.B's are not your friends, they are NOT on "your" side. There is only one way to completely neuter these gentlemen and I think you know what that is. You've got to put them in the same boat so that they are not able to try and torpedo our boat anymore.

So do you honestly think that a no vote will bring these guys back to the table and change their minds on this issue? Or do you think that a no vote will further delay and give a more favorable position to the L-CAL pilot group in the ISL? As Fred was quoted as saying "I hope that they vote no so we can harvest more L-UAL flying".

Just some food for thought.

ALPA Resignation
 

Pretty obvious your senior, won't be stapled, haven't been furloughed, got your bond payment, actually get time at home.

I'm more angry for the people that really need this job for their families. I'll most likely be gone. Don't need it and working on a corporate gig.

ALPA is in no way a union. My pin is off and card will be in the mail on the 16th.

All the best

Mike

First of all, please either give me the Audio of "Fred" saying that, or point me to the exact time, place and person.. when it was said.
The UAL SPSC was at a get together recently in Kingwood. I stole this from the debrief..
The UAL SPSC Chairman and his right hand man both explained that LOA 25 was NOT a last minute deal by Pierce/Baron/Cook to grab seniority. It was done to help ALL pilots. It was further explained that if the TPA expires, there will be no benefit to the CAL pilots by way of UAL losing flying to our benefit. It was explained that the UAL side would only revert to their 2003 protections. They explained that all the fear factor rumors out there regarding shooting down this TA and then LUAL furloughing while LCAL grew were unfounded.

Now, to the reason for my post.
Yes, I "Honestly" think a NO Vote will bring these guys back to the table because-
A) The Company (And Jeffrey) Need labor peace.
It ties into Stock Price.
It ties into favorable interest rates for bank loans (for new equipment).
It ties into Jeffrey's Bonus package.
It ties into running a combined Airline.. smoothly.
B) There will be NEW Reps on the CAL Side, (at least there are Recalls in EWR, CLE and supposedly GUA).
That will change up everything!
C) It will be looked upon as "failure" for everyone involved. No one wants that.
D) The company already has Plan B and Plan C waiting. No Billion Dollar Firm doesn't have backup plans ready.

This is not about the ISL.
I'm a EWR Based guy who lives local. I've got friends on both sides. And many of them want to move to each others bases.
But none of them want to do it under a POS TA.
This TA has too many holes ("The Company may...") and is lacking in numerous areas.
Mind you, it also has some good things.
It's a start. We just need to send it back to fix a few areas..

Never take the first deal~
Motch

Mike,

I'm not passing judgement on you, so please don't take it that way. I'm just saddened by posts like yours. So many great airlines have been destroyed. I bet you were ecstatic your first day of indoc at UAL. Now, you'd probably rather work at Wal Mart. I've had a great career thus far, while others haven't had a bright spot at all. I hope everyone finds something that makes them happy.

Best of Luck

47dog
I am currently a 756 F/O in Den and am five from the bottom of the list on perpetual reserve and unable to EVER break guarantee. Previous to that I was Jr. on reserve A-320 captain commuting to LAX. Home about 9 days a month.

Yeah I got my bond payment. It wasn't enough to change my financial situation in any significant way so what's your point? Since being based in Den on reserve I get more time at home with my family. And so will you after this sh!t storm settles down and life gets more back towards normal.

This job pays my bills, just barely at the moment. I'm not sure how you come to the conclusion that I don't need this job for my family? This is what I do and in fact am working several jobs at the moment.

If that is what you want to do with your life I wish you the best. I used to be a corporate pilot, all I can say is be careful what you are asking for.

I'll provide you an audio tape of Fred just as soon as you can provide me an Audio tape of the UAL MEC SPSC saying that.

FWIW, there IS a tape. Below is the transcript. Check with UAL SPSC Chairman Pete Velzeboer, as he is the one being interviewed by one of the hosts, CAL pilot Sherry Walker. As to the veracity of the comments reportedly made by Abbot, well, didn't that rumor come from one of Dean Coester's "friend of a friend" meltdowns on the Facebook page? There is no way a company officer could or would make fiduciary impacting statements like that.

NOTES FROM THE MONTGOMERY SOCIAL


Below is a transcription of three specific questions that I asked UAL SPSC Chairman Piete Velzeboer. Piete agreed that I could record them so that I wouldn’t misquote his statements. The only thing left out in the text is the “ums” for clarity. Hope this helps dispel some of the fear and myths out there. My sincerest thanks to Captain Velzeboer. He is a stand-up guy, and I appreciate his help in understanding these concerns--SW

1. LOA 25

SW: Can I first just get one thing on the record


PV: Sure


SW: So that everybody in this room understands. The question on LOA 25 with regards to whether or not it was a back room deal cut because Jay Pierce, Cook, and Baron had your side by the “whatevers?”


PV: No, absolutely not.


SW: How did it come about?


PV: Well ok, I gotta tell you, I’m not privy to the inter-meetings of my MEC or the joint MEC. There are certain things that they discuss in and amongst themselves. That’s fine, and I think that is a good thing.They need to do it without a conduit to the outside or whatever. My job is boots on the ground. I organize strikes, I organize Pilot to Pilot, I organize family awareness, and I am not political. I am not an elected rep so I wasn’t in on those meetings. But, I will tell you that that particular LOA was put together by the two MEC’s. The only thing that delayed it was the final language, writing it up. I can tell you a little about the final language of the thing, and why that took so long. I won’t pose it if you don’t want to hear it, but it was not an underhanded, you know gun to the head, type deal. LOA 25 was done to to do something and boost the position of the new hire, the furloughed United Pilots that have been hired by CAL and try to give them something at no one else’s expense. That was the whole “jist” of it. And, that’s what they did. We could not lift them any higher on this side of the seniority list integration. What happens after that, I have no idea. And again, going, i’m not hear to talk about the future in most aspects. I will not talk about conjecture. I will not talk about “if.” That is beyond the scope of my knowledge.”

Later:


2. Can the TPA be arbitrarily extended or modified by one or the other side? My point was to determine if, upon TPA expiration either MEC could approach the company, unilaterally to rescind or extend any of the provisions.


SW: Would you reiterate again, the TPA is an agreement between ALPA National and the Company?


PV: Correct


SW: And that neither unions, no matter what letters they put out or whatever could make an agreement outside of it?


PV: Correct


SW: So Lee Moak is the one, ultimately, to make the decision whether or not to change anything with regards to the TPA agreement.


PV: Yes, this contract will be signed by Lee Moak.


SW: So, with regard to the TPA or any movement to be made on that, Lee Moak is the one to make that decision, not Heppner or Pierce?


PV: I’m sure he would do it if in consensus with them.


Later:


3. I asked about the fear of whip-sawing should the TPA be allowed to expire.


SW: The fear of the “quote un quote” Easternization of United, we dispelled that myth last night, to some extent.


PV: What I said last night was that in our contract 2003, in our scope section, paragraph 1F1, there’s a restriction to UAX block hours as a ratio to our block hours, and there’s also a restriction as to the minimum amount of block hours that United must fly. Now there are some carve outs for that that the company can if they chose to do that. We’re pretty much there. I don’t know what the exacts are but we’re not very far away from the minimum block hours, or the ratios. So, can they transfer? United has to fly a certain amount. United has aircraft on order. They have tentative orders with Airbus and Boeing, playing one against the other, but they are somewhat in the distant future. They don’t have delivery slots or whatever. I don’t have any doubt in my mind. I personally think that if United wanted airplanes they could go to “Airplanes Are Us” and get some. There’s all kinds of open slots at Boeing and Airbus or you could buy somebody else’s slots. So no, UAL’s protections stand.

ALPA Resignation
 

Funny thing. Talking to other furloughed at CAL. Many of us have flown with CAL Capts lately that do want a bid to come out, so they can DOWNGRADE!
They were hoping for better work rules in the TA. When they saw the lousy TA, they want to run back to wide body FO and line holder.

Thankyou Lerxst..
And Thanks to Sherry Q/W for setting up and hosting that event~