mvndc10

I read all this crap about the UAL/CAL AIP and can't but think you guy's have been played.....

They put you guy's on Ice to let the air out of your tires to get past the summer travel season...

ALPA has once again proven what a failure they are....

Enough is Enough what a total joke....

uaav8r

Probably all true "mvndc10". But i'm curious, who are you? You're not a usual in this sandbox. DAL guy?, Anti-ALPA?, Anti-Union? What's your story, mon frere?

slowplay

He's an anti-alpa DAL guy and a big proponent of the "alternative" group that has Seeham as an attorney.

uaav8r

Thx. I figured he had more of an aggenda than his concern for the plight of UCAL pilots.

Dicecal

Who cares what his agenda is, he is correct! Jeffey & his cronies are on a beach this labor day weekend sipping margaritas while we continue to slave away on bankruptcy contracts.

mvndc10

I don't think anyone is "Anti-ALPA"Ladies...

Most everyone wants Fair, Good representation that will get it done and take a stand... Weather that be ALPA UAL Pilots Association or Delta Pilots association Teamsters etc I don't think anyone cares..

But, Let's face it, ALPA these day's is more concerned with ALPA then their Member's as their result's continue to be unsatisfactory they are being voted off slowly from various properties...

ALPA, needs to start performing or step aside.

The Plight at UAL is a embarrassment for all ALPA member's. To think that two ALPA groups could be played that way for that long is ridiculous.

It really go's to show that the RLA is nothing more then a management tool to screw worker's out of negotiation leverage..
If ALPA really wants to make some changes maybe they should put some effort into getting that changed.

Baron50

Ok, I’ll bite, it’s almost Labor Day. You opined that the UAL group has been “played.” Further, you blame the RLA for the demise of negotiating leverage. And, you believe all of this is the fault of ALPA. Others have accused you of being part of the movement to decertify ALPA on the Delta property.

So, a few things you may want to consider before you engage in the long tradition of pilots giving shyster lawyers their money based on the premise that they would do better if they threw those ALPA goons off the property, or a promise to right some other injustice.

First of all, it does not matter what name is on that union card in your wallet. A union is no better than the resolve and courage of its membership. If you start another union, the same people will be elected to lead you, they will have the same inclinations as your current leadership. The lawyers and staff of your new union will be no different from ALPA’s. They will protect their interests first; in other words, do nothing to jeopardize the union organization, their pay, or their jobs. If they can also help you, all the better, but the governing principle is the staff is not going to lead you, you have to do that yourself. If you are just now finding this out about ALPA, either you are new or incredibly naive.

If the DAL pilot group wants to do something, they can do it, ALPA will not stand in the way. Take away your dues money and the organization would fail, you are the gorilla. If things are not as you would like at DAL, it is only your fault.

It seems somewhat disingenuous that a DAL pilot would say the UAL pilots were played, considering your recent negotiations. In fairness, you may have been part of the “no” group. If so, good for you, but don’t blame ALPA for that debacle, just look around the crew room, that is where your problem lies. Your airline has never struck, it probably never will, that is your culture. If you know who you are, you will be a lot happier in your career. The deal you got was probably the best that your pilot group could have expected. When your cohorts find out that management will be back for a second round because the agreement is not workable, unforeseen problems, etc., you will have the satisfaction to say, “I told you so.” The RLA is not a real DAL problem.

The RLA is a problem for UAL pilots, but not because it has impeded their ability to get a contract. That was self inflicted. Years were wasted believing that merger money would cause management to be benevolent. When these fools in the union leadership were removed, things started to progress, their was no need to start another union, just an election.

Unlike your airline, the legacy UAL pilots understand that leverage is necessary for a satisfactory resolution and are prepared to use the legal strike tool. The CAL guys are a quick study and are just as resolute to get an agreement. The NMB may need some prodding, but that may only be a timing issue. If not, it may very well be that the fight will have to go to the courts. Notwithstanding the RLA, all private labor unions are given their right to strike by Congress, not the executive branch.

The lack of recent airline strikes is not because of the RLA, it is a result a methodical, decade’s long campaign by business interests to denigrate unionism. They have convinced many young airline workers to believe a myth; the government won’t let us strike, it is un-American and management is too powerful… all rubbish. I will try to be a bit positive, there is a bright spot, (and who would have thought) the AMR pilots stood up to union leadership, management and a judge. It doesn’t get any better than that.

Let’s celebrate Labor Day by remembering those that have gone before us in the struggle for fairness in the work place.

Baron

dogfood

nevermind. sigh

SoCentralRain

+1
Excellent retort, Baron.

MVNDC10, you've been served.

SCR

A320

Stay focused everyone.