Zoomie

Good question tsquare...

We were "trying" to do just that up until the DL contract popped up 7 months before amendable date. Congrats btw. No one knows how we were going to do it, but we were fighting tooth and nail to make it happen. Perhaps it was an impossible task as you allude.

However, I guess we're on our own since the "pattern bargaining" concept didn't work out with you guys at DL, USair is FUBAR, and AA is in bankruptcy. It appears that when the DL contract was signed, the UA JNC no longer had any "wind in its sails" with regards to scope.

I guess we could have kept fighting at that point, but I imagine we'll all see in a few weeks when the TA comes out, we did not. I imagine our scope will look similar to the DL deal, with a UA twist, and it will pass the pilots if it makes it past the MEC vote. It's OK, since all the analysts in financial corners have predicted pilots would sell larger RJ scope for pay raises, and you did, and we will follow suit.

For all the RJ bubbas that have been begging CAL to hold onto our scope, sorry. It looks as thought that ain't gonna happen, unless you believe in miracles.

krudawg

$400 mil total retro for 12,000 pilots? Holy Crap, that's got to be false. But I have heard a retro pay-out in to phases. In reality, NOBODY knows the details except for the Jay's and the NC's and they aint talking.

Airhoss

I can make up any number I want and insert it here. It's simply BS until we actually see the print on the TA.

Then everyone can come back here and righteously bisch about it. And no matter what it is good or bad there will be folks bisching about it.

I remember hearing complaints about contract 2000 when it came out.

syd111

We will see if and when the ta comes out, as far as contract 2000 yep I did airhoss and voted against it along with 300 plus others, oh well.

You are right though will be plnty of complaining if and when.

embflieger

Since we won't really know what's in the AIP until we see it, might anybody have reliable information as to when that might be?

tsquare

Pattern bargaining didn't work? Really?

Hmmmmm from APC (admittedly I do not know how reliable the source is for the UAL rate, but...)

UAL 747A $190/hr
DAL 747A (As of July 1) $234.78

Ummmmm and in January of 2015, a 717 CA at DAL will be making $195.13

But I can see where you think there is nothing to pattern off of there.

This is not my thread really, and maybe I should have let this go, but when someone intimates that we caved at DAL, I can bite my tongue no longer. You can be referring to the scope issue, and if you believe that was a cave, then again, you are wrong. We recaptured scope and tied RJs to mainline flying. Your scope issues are yours to decide, and blaming DAL for your problems there is as legitimate as BO blaming GWB for all the country's woes. You have a real problem because of your differences, and it is interesting as to how it will be solved.

My question was based solely in wondering how you are going to go from having two very desperate scope clauses to obtaining the more restrictive one AND raining the pay bar that we have set. Nothing more. I am not saying it is impossible, but I can only imagine how difficult it will be. Getting it all in this next contract might very well be impossible, but as time goes on, those things can be accomplished.

syd111

Your right it's not your thread.

jdt30

So what happens in 2016 when they want to outsource 100 seat jets at Delta? Do you ask them to shrink the 76 seat flying, then ask for a small raise?

flap

Tsquare,

Not saying you caved, but:

You guys did an outstanding job by getting a new contract prior to ammendable date.

How did that happen? One reason only;the company wanted something from you, they got it, and they paid dearly.

That upped the ante for our negotiations and it is tough to get your pay without the concession to scope that came with it.

Yes you tightened up your language which always makes the attorneys happy, but the fact is you bought and paid for your own raise.

Time will tell whether it was a good purchase but waaaaaaaay too early to make that call.

Justdoinmyjob

Why would they want to outsource 100 seat jets in 2016 when they would have just finished paying the initial costs of opening the category on mainline? They wanted 86 seats at DCI this go around and didn't get them. Your premise that Delta will cave is flawed and not based on any kind of reality. A more likely outlook for 2016 will see a vastly reduced set of regionals as more either shutdown or merge between now and then.

Of course, you wanna chase a bogeyman to make you feel better, have at it.