Interesting take on Negotiations
07-07-2012, 04:30 AM
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Interesting take on Negotiations
This is from 'Plane Business' a weekly blog about the airline industry:
So back to the United/Continental pilot negotiations.
No question I will be getting into the reasons why this latest intensive round of negotiations failed in more detail in the next few weeks, but here is my short and sweet take.
Regarding the deal that I understand was under consideration at the end of last week, I don't think the two sides are that far apart. From what I hear from both sides, there were hundreds of items taken care of over the last month, and as for the the few remaining items -- the sides are not that far apart.
But two things kept this deal from coming together. Union politics on the United Airlines side, and the timing of the news on the Delta Air Lines pilot union vote.
I think there was reluctance on the part of United to commit to some items, especially pay rates, when the outcome of the Delta contract was still up in the air.
Meanwhile, on the United union side, I think United ALPA MEC Chairman Jay Heppner is caught up in that "I need to look like I am holding strong in front of my members" mode.
Interestingly, for those of you who follow such things, you may remember that it was the Continental pilot group that a few years ago was stuck on the scope issue when company negotiators threw the then-Delta contract on the table and said they would best the pay rates by a dollar and match the rest of the contract line by line.
There was a good reason for that. The Delta contract, which was the one negotiated as part of the Delta/Northwest deal, gave the airline much more flexibility in terms of codesharing and scope.
From what I hear, the guys at Continental now appear to understand why the company needs more flexibility -- which is exactly what Delta got with its first merger contract. And which was just expanded upon with this latest contract.
Meanwhile, on the United side, it appears to be an internal political ****ing contest between the factions within the pilot union. Is it as bad as the situation at US Airways? Everyone I talk to says no, but I've always been leery of a similar situation breaking out with this group.
In addition, the more radical of the United group have apparently been mesmerized by some Washington lobbyists who appear to be telling them that it would be to their advantage to push the NMB to release them, and then push on to a potential strike. One union-related person told me last week, "We have assurances that a PEB would be set up quickly, and that a resulting deal would be to our advantage."
Yeah, right. And I have a lot in Timbuktu I'll sell you for $1000. Great deal.
Funny thing about Washington lobbyists. They will tell you exactly what you want to hear, introduce you to "stars" on the Hill, take a lot of your money, and then what?
Sorry guys, but with the election coming up, and with a required DOT analysis of the economic impact of a release, and with the inevitable conclusion that the combined airline is simply too big to allow a strike to take place, if you believe what these high-priced lobbyists are telling you, you need to have your head examined.
The best way for these negotiations to be settled is at the table, and I still am optimistic that this can happen. But somebody in the United MEC (and I'm not naming names) is going to have to stop playing political junkie and start doing what is best for the airline -- which will then be best for the membership. In other words, be a leader.
We saw this "big picture" understanding with the Delta contract. That's what we have to see with the United contract as well. The airline has to be allowed to be competitive on the international playing field.
So back to the United/Continental pilot negotiations.
No question I will be getting into the reasons why this latest intensive round of negotiations failed in more detail in the next few weeks, but here is my short and sweet take.
Regarding the deal that I understand was under consideration at the end of last week, I don't think the two sides are that far apart. From what I hear from both sides, there were hundreds of items taken care of over the last month, and as for the the few remaining items -- the sides are not that far apart.
But two things kept this deal from coming together. Union politics on the United Airlines side, and the timing of the news on the Delta Air Lines pilot union vote.
I think there was reluctance on the part of United to commit to some items, especially pay rates, when the outcome of the Delta contract was still up in the air.
Meanwhile, on the United union side, I think United ALPA MEC Chairman Jay Heppner is caught up in that "I need to look like I am holding strong in front of my members" mode.
Interestingly, for those of you who follow such things, you may remember that it was the Continental pilot group that a few years ago was stuck on the scope issue when company negotiators threw the then-Delta contract on the table and said they would best the pay rates by a dollar and match the rest of the contract line by line.
There was a good reason for that. The Delta contract, which was the one negotiated as part of the Delta/Northwest deal, gave the airline much more flexibility in terms of codesharing and scope.
From what I hear, the guys at Continental now appear to understand why the company needs more flexibility -- which is exactly what Delta got with its first merger contract. And which was just expanded upon with this latest contract.
Meanwhile, on the United side, it appears to be an internal political ****ing contest between the factions within the pilot union. Is it as bad as the situation at US Airways? Everyone I talk to says no, but I've always been leery of a similar situation breaking out with this group.
In addition, the more radical of the United group have apparently been mesmerized by some Washington lobbyists who appear to be telling them that it would be to their advantage to push the NMB to release them, and then push on to a potential strike. One union-related person told me last week, "We have assurances that a PEB would be set up quickly, and that a resulting deal would be to our advantage."
Yeah, right. And I have a lot in Timbuktu I'll sell you for $1000. Great deal.
Funny thing about Washington lobbyists. They will tell you exactly what you want to hear, introduce you to "stars" on the Hill, take a lot of your money, and then what?
Sorry guys, but with the election coming up, and with a required DOT analysis of the economic impact of a release, and with the inevitable conclusion that the combined airline is simply too big to allow a strike to take place, if you believe what these high-priced lobbyists are telling you, you need to have your head examined.
The best way for these negotiations to be settled is at the table, and I still am optimistic that this can happen. But somebody in the United MEC (and I'm not naming names) is going to have to stop playing political junkie and start doing what is best for the airline -- which will then be best for the membership. In other words, be a leader.
We saw this "big picture" understanding with the Delta contract. That's what we have to see with the United contract as well. The airline has to be allowed to be competitive on the international playing field.
07-07-2012, 05:12 AM
#3
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Joined APC: Jan 2008
Posts: 400
This "take" shouldn't be a big surprise and is no great revelation. We all knew both sides wanted to see the Delta outcome and the direction AA was going so no deal recently can hardly be a shock.
Plenty of people have been commenting this deal might look quite a bit like Delta as it's obvious UAX 50 seaters are no spring chickens like Delta's. Of course UCH is interested in parting ways with these gas guzzler upcoming maintenance hogs and move up to 70 seaters like DAL. In reality the question becomes how many 70 seaters and how to push flying back to mainline as the regional hull numbers decline.
It seems the lobbyist/UAL side politics thing is a bit overblown but it makes for a good read. Not getting the impression the situation is quite that divisive but perhaps wrong on that...
Plenty of people have been commenting this deal might look quite a bit like Delta as it's obvious UAX 50 seaters are no spring chickens like Delta's. Of course UCH is interested in parting ways with these gas guzzler upcoming maintenance hogs and move up to 70 seaters like DAL. In reality the question becomes how many 70 seaters and how to push flying back to mainline as the regional hull numbers decline.
It seems the lobbyist/UAL side politics thing is a bit overblown but it makes for a good read. Not getting the impression the situation is quite that divisive but perhaps wrong on that...
07-07-2012, 06:16 AM
#6
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Joined APC: Feb 2012
Posts: 222
"From what I hear, the guys at Continental now appear to understand why the company needs more flexibility -- which is exactly what Delta got with its first merger contract. And which was just expanded upon with this latest contract."
Is this saying CAL pilots are ready to cave on scope?
Is this saying CAL pilots are ready to cave on scope?
07-07-2012, 06:36 AM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 844
"From what I hear, the guys at Continental now appear to understand why the company needs more flexibility -- which is exactly what Delta got with its first merger contract. And which was just expanded upon with this latest contract."
Is this saying CAL pilots are ready to cave on scope?
Is this saying CAL pilots are ready to cave on scope?
United Airlines would use this so called "flexibility" to become a holding company, outscourcing all of it's flying.
07-07-2012, 06:53 AM
#8
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Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DTW 717A
Posts: 1,099
Ironic thay UCH/DAL/AMR cannot "be competitive" without outsourcing more flying. I've been in the regionals for 6 years and have never met a single regional pilot who would not leap at the chance to do the same job for the same pay on a major list instead. My view is that it is easy for management to explain outsourcing as a monetary benefit but in reality it only exists to divide labor groups that they fear would become too powerful.
07-07-2012, 07:07 AM
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 239
"From what I hear, the guys at Continental now appear to understand why the company needs more flexibility -- which is exactly what Delta got with its first merger contract. And which was just expanded upon with this latest contract."
Is this saying CAL pilots are ready to cave on scope?
Is this saying CAL pilots are ready to cave on scope?
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