XHooker

Hoorhay, not really disagreeing, but in sticking to the facts, the percentage decrease in your mainline domestic flying was matched by the increase in outsourced flying by your "regional partners" (percentage basis only...I don't know the actual numbers). This was made possible by your scope language. The recession of '08 certainly had a lot to do with this. CAL flying decreased and 148 pilots were furloughed. Our scope language prevented the outsourcing losses from being worse.

XHooker

My basic math skills would say the opposite is true.

XHooker

A point that can't be hammered home hard enough. With more hubs, the large turboprops (less than 80 seats is the CAL scope) become practical on more routes since more cities are within their radius.

13n144e

Again, I never said anything about 737's. This was originally a discussion on the loss of scope and the subsequent initial furlough. But I also question how the 737's could have been parked for the second furlough if the scope section had not been scrapped. Were they not replaced by RJ's? I've flown with ex-SkyWest guys who claimed they upgraded because of the growth there from picking up the 737 flying. Again, whether you like it or not the "right sizing" for merger scenario is just speculation: "if/when said entity was announced".

13n144e

What the hell is the matter with you? I truly question whether a buffoon like yourself could ever have been hired by UAL, let alone any airline. Fortunately I know a number of UAL pilots that are true professionals, so I know your not representative of the group. Your attempts at making little satirical comments never make any sense and usually sound like they were written by someone with a grade school education. You should stick with your ineffectual droning rants on Pierce.

13n144e

No. That's just all the time I'm going to waste responding to your mindless, moronic drivel.

UASnake

Well, actually there was an 1113C process. See United Airlines - United Airlines 1113C Motion

Now, whether it ran it's full course I don't recall, but I agree with you that we caved. The then MC, some on the MEC, and large number of line pilots were scared witless about UAL going away and were willing to do most anything to keep the lights on. Hell, I remember hearing that pilots were calling their Reps in tears and telling them to give the company what they wanted.

Still, I think that Ewr saying that we "negotiated" the present scope clause is BS. UAL was going to get what they wanted from Judge Wedoff, and the only way we could stop that was with a very credible threat to burn the place down, but the ratification vote %s indicate the majority was clearly not willing to do it and so that tool was not available. So, yeah it was consensual, in the sense that a rape victim "consenting" to the rapist to avoid being murdered means it was consensual. I would have preferred to fight the rapist with matches and gasoline.

"If you are unwilling to lose everything, eventually, you will." +1

reCALcitrant

Except you had the matches and gasoline and the victim wasn't willing to use them. They're still not. From what I understand, your senior bunch over there is still living a pretty nice life while the bus folks are shlepping it out day to day. Just what I've heard from the UAL guys I work with. We need to fix this problem on the JCBA. I know the CAL guys I talk with say the tone is pretty good from the line pilot.

This is a great chance to level the playing field for ALL the pilots and get a great contract that is out of balance in our favor.

We have to get away from SCAB this SCAB that. Not that you've said any of it. Both airlines have them, they are disgusting, and they are minimal. CAL has a majority of its guys hired since 98. I think most are ready to do what it takes to bring management to its knees. They just need good leadership and direction on how to do it.

APC225

We can hope. LAX had an LEC meeting a few days ago. It was a "packed house" according to their blastmail--but with just a single FO in attendance. That apathy does not bode well for the B3 group and reserve rules, scope and B scale that need to be changed.

Slammer

Yeah but look at the employee numbers in LAX and that tells you the story....