Negotiated profit sharing 2011
01-03-2012, 12:46 PM
#141
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: EWR B737FO
Posts: 225
The below is from last weeks position report.
Let me elaborate. We had two unresolved Scope grievances at the end of the year, one relating to twin-aisle block hour non-compliance and the other regarding the sale of B-767-200 aircraft. We decided to entertain settling the B-767-200 sale grievance (but not the twin-aisle block hour grievance) in pursuit of profit sharing. While neither our contract nor the Transition and Process Agreement (TPA) precludes the Company from selling aircraft, our contract precludes them from doing so if it is related to the merger (but does not preclude them from doing so for economic reasons not related to the complete transaction). In other words, our argument in this grievance was that it was only with the addition of the UAL aircraft, due to the merger, that the B-767-200 became a surplus aircraft, lending them to the possibility of disposal. What the Company argued was that the aircraft was meant to be replaced by the B-787 (unrelated to the merger). We have never argued against this point, as we have been told for quite some time that this was the plan. However, our position was that the B-787 had not yet arrived and therefore, the contemplated sale was premature.
Let me elaborate. We had two unresolved Scope grievances at the end of the year, one relating to twin-aisle block hour non-compliance and the other regarding the sale of B-767-200 aircraft. We decided to entertain settling the B-767-200 sale grievance (but not the twin-aisle block hour grievance) in pursuit of profit sharing. While neither our contract nor the Transition and Process Agreement (TPA) precludes the Company from selling aircraft, our contract precludes them from doing so if it is related to the merger (but does not preclude them from doing so for economic reasons not related to the complete transaction). In other words, our argument in this grievance was that it was only with the addition of the UAL aircraft, due to the merger, that the B-767-200 became a surplus aircraft, lending them to the possibility of disposal. What the Company argued was that the aircraft was meant to be replaced by the B-787 (unrelated to the merger). We have never argued against this point, as we have been told for quite some time that this was the plan. However, our position was that the B-787 had not yet arrived and therefore, the contemplated sale was premature.
01-03-2012, 12:53 PM
#142
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: B-777 left
Posts: 1,415
There is no leverage. That's the point. Ewrbasedpilot said it best...
These same pilots are now pacified for awhile with profit sharing. Had we arrived at 14 Feb feeling "kicked in the nads" it may well have created some leverage which would accelerate the JCBA.
Now $100k retro, delayed. Pay, delayed. Work rules, delayed. For the company it's all about delay. They've won another battle.
These same pilots are now pacified for awhile with profit sharing. Had we arrived at 14 Feb feeling "kicked in the nads" it may well have created some leverage which would accelerate the JCBA.
Now $100k retro, delayed. Pay, delayed. Work rules, delayed. For the company it's all about delay. They've won another battle.
01-03-2012, 01:05 PM
#143
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 621
What do you think would have happened on Feb 14th had this deal not gone through? Do you think the CAL side would have shut down? Did the UAL shut down when their retirement was yanked? Did UAL shut down when 1400 were furloughed (some for the second time less than 4 years)? Did UAL shut down when they started retiring the 757's while CAL increased 737 deliveries?
But this time is different? This time the company crossed the line by not paying the CAL pilots.
01-03-2012, 01:12 PM
#144
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: B-777 left
Posts: 1,415
Who the heck is this going to pacify? Not me. Unless profit sharing comes with enhanced work rules, more pay, etc., etc., then no, I am not pacified. Heck, I'm ****ed that this profit sharing is still less than that originally promised in Contract '02.
What do you think would have happened on Feb 14th had this deal not gone through? Do you think the CAL side would have shut down? Did the UAL shut down when their retirement was yanked? Did UAL shut down when 1400 were furloughed (some for the second time less than 4 years)? Did UAL shut down when they started retiring the 757's while CAL increased 737 deliveries?
But this time is different? This time the company crossed the line by not paying the CAL pilots.
What do you think would have happened on Feb 14th had this deal not gone through? Do you think the CAL side would have shut down? Did the UAL shut down when their retirement was yanked? Did UAL shut down when 1400 were furloughed (some for the second time less than 4 years)? Did UAL shut down when they started retiring the 757's while CAL increased 737 deliveries?
But this time is different? This time the company crossed the line by not paying the CAL pilots.
01-03-2012, 01:18 PM
#145
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 621
My question is, when will you start doing something for your pilot group?
By the way, our training department is filled with new hires from UAL. They are getting paid at the rate which they left UAL. There are even some new hires making 747 Captain pay. That means that I am getting paid significantly less a new hire. You know what I think? Good for them.
By the way, our training department is filled with new hires from UAL. They are getting paid at the rate which they left UAL. There are even some new hires making 747 Captain pay. That means that I am getting paid significantly less a new hire. You know what I think? Good for them.
01-03-2012, 01:33 PM
#146
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: B-777 left
Posts: 1,415
My question is, when will you start doing something for your pilot group?
By the way, our training department is filled with new hires from UAL. They are getting paid at the rate which they left UAL. There are even some new hires making 747 Captain pay. That means that I am getting paid significantly less a new hire. You know what I think? Good for them.
By the way, our training department is filled with new hires from UAL. They are getting paid at the rate which they left UAL. There are even some new hires making 747 Captain pay. That means that I am getting paid significantly less a new hire. You know what I think? Good for them.
I guess my question for you is when have you done anything for any pilot group?
01-03-2012, 01:41 PM
#148
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Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: B-777 left
Posts: 1,415
01-03-2012, 01:43 PM
#149
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Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 621
I can't speak for all CAL pilots, but I would be happy. Domicile and furlough protection are some of the few things that actually give us leverage in a JCBA negotiation. Again, as I have been told, these were all on the table and attainable along with CAL's profit sharing, but your MEC asked for CAL pay rates and the Company ended the negotiations.
01-03-2012, 01:45 PM
#150
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: B-777 left
Posts: 1,415
I can't speak for all CAL pilots, but I would be happy. Domicile and furlough protection are some of the few things that actually give us leverage in a JCBA negotiation. Again, as I have been told, these were all on the table and attainable along with CAL's profit sharing, but your MEC asked for CAL pay rates and the Company ended the negotiations.
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