1257

This thread isn't about how much lcal pilots are required to fly, obviously the contract is the contract
and imho lual guys are empathetic with the lcal guys regarding the bad workrules they're subject to.

It's about no longer volunteering for JRM/LCA/Optional flying on both sides.
lual and lcal pilots have both been called out about the volunteering while the Co. says "what's the rush?" during a bankruptcy contract.
That's very different than issues with a schedule built by PBS or mandatory crew desk assignments.

Let's keep it on topic and not stray to contract differences, that's for another thread.
Accepting optional flying or being available when you don't have to is volunteering, it needs to stop now on both sides, no excuses.

SoCalGuy

All good.

I hear you on the 61+ hours. When I saw this, I went to a "PBS Guru" and asked him straight-faced......"How is the safe"??? You litterally fly 3-four day trips squeezed into 10 calendar days, and too boot, all six-10+ hour legs are North/South Red-Eyes?!?! Don't know about you, but that's just a set-up for a 'mistake' that could get ugly....thus the "call" for the 3rd trip in the Death March.

There are VERY FEW Pilots at L-CAL that I know of within the B756 Fleet who have a real "jones'in" for this type of line. I didn't "ask" for it, but PBS found that 'double secret loop' in which to build it out.

All in all, I agree....This type of PBS award/flying NEEDS to be taken care of by STRONG/SOLID work rules via this JCBA. Staying on topic of the thread, the JM'ing needs to STOP NOW, and those line holder's who 'accept' it with open arms are doing NOTHING for this combine group.

Cheers.

APC225

This won't change from pilot unity or goodwill. It has to be in a contract. Talked to folks recently who intentionally (and excitedly I might add) ask for days off and VRF on days they calculate junior manning to be most likely. Then they have at it when the offers start flowing.

1257

That's really sad, sort of the pinnacle of selfishness to the detriment of motivating contract negotiations.
There will always be ways for people to work the system, imho what we have to do now
is hold ourselves, and those around us, to doing the right thing. If we're honest with ourselves, that right thing is obvious.

SoCal, thank you for standing up for the group's best interests.

Andy

Then my point was missed. VJM doesn't matter. LCAL scheduling will man the flights by any means necessary. VJM is one of the tools used to man the flights but it can be done entirely through other means. That includes flying reserves until they state that they're fatigued and changing line pilots' IDs to cover flying shortages.

There's also another issue with stopping VJM - status quo. If you read the lawsuit against DALPA, you'll see that DALPA lost their case because there were less pilots volunteering for overtime. The court ruled that the status quo needed to be maintained.
If, as you suggest, pilots stop VJM, LCA, etc, you can bet that the company will sue due to this being a status quo violation.

1257

Good, let them man the flights through methods other than JRM
and we can address those as they come up in another thread.
No JRM, no excuses.
And if they want to sue for status quo, that's fine.
Our actions have to stop being driven by fear and greed, and start being driven by what's right.
No volunteering, period.

APC225

When you can make nearly $30k in a month by doing this it's pretty hard to convince someone not do it based on fraternal camaraderie. If they stopped doing it they might get their $200k retro check this year vs 2014, but shortsightedness trumps strategic thinking.

syd111

Nice let me know when you see that 200k retro, just you guys I assume, lol

1257

Agree, the issue with that is there is a big difference between fraternal camaraderie and what's ethically right by the group.
They like to downplay their self-absorption but it's severely unethical, in multiple ways, as an individual and to this pilot group.
Saying it's not while they're hiding their schedules and bragging about personal excess is as oxymoronic as one can get.

XHooker

Andy, IMO, there's only so far they can go without VJM.

Not an expert, but my recollection as an interested party was that DALALPA had publicly told pilots not to VJM. That's what they got slapped for. A court order can't force individual pilots to fly more.

I don't think the company has a case unless the union tells pilots not to VJM.