CAL Replacing UAL flying, not new flying
10-05-2011, 09:36 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Position: Left - Dodge Caravan
Posts: 357
Who is flying what flying is not something to fight each other over. However, being a former Eastern pilot where the CAL management was mostly the same as it is now, IMHO, they are using the same tactics here. EAL flying was shifted over to CAL and eventually totally taken over.
There are some differences here that may make a difference. EAL and CAL were not merged. EAL pilots were trying to get a contract while CAL had come out of bankruptcy and were not represented by a union. Here CAL and UAL are negotiating for a JCBA. Hopefully this will make a difference. The way it looks, management is trying to play the same game here. What we must remember is that once we combine, we will be one airline if that ever happens. Let's not fight with each other and fight for a common goal.
There are some differences here that may make a difference. EAL and CAL were not merged. EAL pilots were trying to get a contract while CAL had come out of bankruptcy and were not represented by a union. Here CAL and UAL are negotiating for a JCBA. Hopefully this will make a difference. The way it looks, management is trying to play the same game here. What we must remember is that once we combine, we will be one airline if that ever happens. Let's not fight with each other and fight for a common goal.
If this trend continues in the wrong direction, a large group of these pilots could reach the breaking point, and all depart at once while keeping seniority and recall rights at UAL intact. In addition other UAL pilots who bypassed the offer may feel compelled at this point to accept first rights at any training openings and also resign when finished. With the current CAL staffing model, this could make for one very interesting summer in the near future.
SP
10-06-2011, 05:55 AM
#23
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Cap
Posts: 2,282
The same TPA that would allow a shift of flying from UAL to CAL also has a poison pill that remains intact. The filling of CAL vacancies with UAL pilots, who do not relinquish recall rights at UAL going forward.
If this trend continues in the wrong direction, a large group of these pilots could reach the breaking point, and all depart at once while keeping seniority and recall rights at UAL intact. In addition other UAL pilots who bypassed the offer may feel compelled at this point to accept first rights at any training openings and also resign when finished. With the current CAL staffing model, this could make for one very interesting summer in the near future.
SP
If this trend continues in the wrong direction, a large group of these pilots could reach the breaking point, and all depart at once while keeping seniority and recall rights at UAL intact. In addition other UAL pilots who bypassed the offer may feel compelled at this point to accept first rights at any training openings and also resign when finished. With the current CAL staffing model, this could make for one very interesting summer in the near future.
SP
10-06-2011, 08:35 AM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2009
Posts: 645
I just read on the United forum that the first class at Continental has a number of Captains including a couple 747 ones that took voluntary furloughs. They are going back to be 737 FO's at $190/hour. If United decides to fulough again, a pilot can take a voluntary furlough, get paid I think it was 4 months severance, and start in a class at Continental the next day making the pay he was at United. So how how are they going to save money?
10-06-2011, 09:28 AM
#25
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Joined APC: May 2010
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... Furloughing from UAL is going to create the mother of all disasters for management. It will more than double training costs, as furloughed pilots would need to go to CAL indoc and then new airplane training. Then when UAL starts to recall, they go back and have to redo it all over again at UAL, thus decimating the CAL staffing...
... Captains including a couple 747 ones that took voluntary furloughs... are going back to be 737 FO's at $190/hour. If United decides to fulough again, a pilot can take a voluntary furlough, get paid I think it was 4 months severance, and start in a class at Continental the next day making the pay he was at United...
10-06-2011, 09:30 AM
#26
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Position: Furlough/Gun Driver
Posts: 437
You beat me too it. Furloughing from UAL is going to create the mother of all disasters for management. It will more than double training costs, as furloughed pilots would need to go to CAL indoc and then new airplane training. Then when UAL starts to recall, they go back and have to redo it all over again at UAL, thus decimating the CAL staffing. I hope even our management can see how disruptive and expensive that would be to their own airline
10-06-2011, 09:58 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Position: Left - Dodge Caravan
Posts: 357
Also, if it comes to this, I am sure that timing one's last CAL flight will be part of the process. Glad those travel benefits from UAL will still work to eventually return from the remote outstations on a CAL aircraft one just resigned from!
If they make it to the end of the UAL invite list of those that need jobs at CAL now, then it will be time for those that bypassed CAL to take a few weeks or months (for those that like extra sessions in the box) to visit IAH and sample the training.
Kinda like an iceberg, there is more of it than meets the eye.
SP
10-06-2011, 10:47 AM
#28
Pilot Response
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10-06-2011, 11:59 AM
#29
Fore!
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Position: 756 F/O
Posts: 505
I just read on the United forum that the first class at Continental has a number of Captains including a couple 747 ones that took voluntary furloughs. They are going back to be 737 FO's at $190/hour. If United decides to fulough again, a pilot can take a voluntary furlough, get paid I think it was 4 months severance, and start in a class at Continental the next day making the pay he was at United. So how how are they going to save money?
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