NO JCBA until at least END of October.
09-24-2010, 09:03 PM
#1
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Joined APC: Aug 2010
Position: Furlough United Airlines Pilot
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NO JCBA until at least END of October.
If I read this update correctly it does not look like we will have a JCBA until at least the end of October at the earliest.
You be the judge:
This week the Joint Negotiating Committee (JNC) spent the first part of the week at a Special MEC meeting with the UAL and CAL MECs. The JNC updated the MECs on its progress at the table, noting that the JNC has provided the Company proposals on nearly all sections of the Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA). There have been delays on some Company counter proposals due to anti-trust issues between the Airlines prior to Merger Closing Date. After October 1, the Company has indicated they will be able to provide more data and a more definitive business plan to the JNC. The JNC will then spend the week following the MEC and ALPA Board of Directors meetings to review this data in preparation for re-engagement with Company management later in October.
Mid-week, the JNC had scheduling and fatigue mitigation subject matter experts (SMEs) in for a conference with management and their SMEs to discuss the NPRM on Flight Time and Duty Time Limits. The remainder of the week was spent preparing proposals and counter-proposals on sections that are owed to the Company. The JNC intends to present as many of these proposals as possible to the Company next week.
You be the judge:
This week the Joint Negotiating Committee (JNC) spent the first part of the week at a Special MEC meeting with the UAL and CAL MECs. The JNC updated the MECs on its progress at the table, noting that the JNC has provided the Company proposals on nearly all sections of the Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA). There have been delays on some Company counter proposals due to anti-trust issues between the Airlines prior to Merger Closing Date. After October 1, the Company has indicated they will be able to provide more data and a more definitive business plan to the JNC. The JNC will then spend the week following the MEC and ALPA Board of Directors meetings to review this data in preparation for re-engagement with Company management later in October.
Mid-week, the JNC had scheduling and fatigue mitigation subject matter experts (SMEs) in for a conference with management and their SMEs to discuss the NPRM on Flight Time and Duty Time Limits. The remainder of the week was spent preparing proposals and counter-proposals on sections that are owed to the Company. The JNC intends to present as many of these proposals as possible to the Company next week.
09-25-2010, 05:41 AM
#4
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Joined APC: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
I wouldn't be surprised in a crappy 11th hour desperation play by Mgmt just to see if the CAL guys who voted "yes" last time will still "save" the company...why throw out the play book when it has proven accurate thus far...
09-25-2010, 07:11 AM
#5
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Joined APC: Jul 2010
Posts: 363
If I read this update correctly it does not look like we will have a JCBA until at least the end of October at the earliest.
There have been delays on some Company counter proposals due to anti-trust issues between the Airlines prior to Merger Closing Date. After October 1, the Company has indicated they will be able to provide more data and a more definitive business plan to the JNC.
There have been delays on some Company counter proposals due to anti-trust issues between the Airlines prior to Merger Closing Date. After October 1, the Company has indicated they will be able to provide more data and a more definitive business plan to the JNC.
Of course this wouldn't be anything new to mgmt...
KC
09-25-2010, 07:29 AM
#6
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Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: 737 CAPT
Posts: 1,905
Is it me or wouldn't this suggest that the company did not negotiate in good faith when it agreed to the original time schedule. So long as the MCD hadn't come and gone they could always say they were not able to fully negotiate due to anti-trust issues, so they never intended to complete the JCBA before the MCD.
Of course this wouldn't be anything new to mgmt...
KC
Of course this wouldn't be anything new to mgmt...
KC
09-25-2010, 07:47 AM
#7
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Joined APC: Apr 2010
Position: 777 CAP
Posts: 771
Read Betweeen
I know the info from the Union has been sparse, but let's look at the information first before we get our panties in a bunch.
If I read this update correctly it does not look like we will have a JCBA until at least the end of October at the earliest.
You be the judge:
This week the Joint Negotiating Committee (JNC) spent the first part of the week at a Special MEC meeting with the UAL and CAL MECs. The JNC updated the MECs on its progress at the table, noting that the JNC has provided the Company proposals on nearly all sections of the Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA). There have been delays on some Company counter proposals due to anti-trust issues between the Airlines prior to Merger Closing Date. After October 1, the Company has indicated they will be able to provide more data and a more definitive business plan to the JNC. The JNC will then spend the week following the MEC and ALPA Board of Directors meetings to review this data in preparation for re-engagement with Company management later in October.
Mid-week, the JNC had scheduling and fatigue mitigation subject matter experts (SMEs) in for a conference with management and their SMEs to discuss the NPRM on Flight Time and Duty Time Limits. The remainder of the week was spent preparing proposals and counter-proposals on sections that are owed to the Company. The JNC intends to present as many of these proposals as possible to the Company next week.
You be the judge:
This week the Joint Negotiating Committee (JNC) spent the first part of the week at a Special MEC meeting with the UAL and CAL MECs. The JNC updated the MECs on its progress at the table, noting that the JNC has provided the Company proposals on nearly all sections of the Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA). There have been delays on some Company counter proposals due to anti-trust issues between the Airlines prior to Merger Closing Date. After October 1, the Company has indicated they will be able to provide more data and a more definitive business plan to the JNC. The JNC will then spend the week following the MEC and ALPA Board of Directors meetings to review this data in preparation for re-engagement with Company management later in October.
Mid-week, the JNC had scheduling and fatigue mitigation subject matter experts (SMEs) in for a conference with management and their SMEs to discuss the NPRM on Flight Time and Duty Time Limits. The remainder of the week was spent preparing proposals and counter-proposals on sections that are owed to the Company. The JNC intends to present as many of these proposals as possible to the Company next week.
- Do you think the company can respond to our financial proposals if they don't even know each other's financials?
- Should the union spend some time going over the NPDM and consider how it affects our contract before negotiating our work rules?
- Considering these alone, was Oct 5 ever a realistic deadline?
Last edited by Monkeyfly; 09-25-2010 at 09:06 AM.
09-25-2010, 08:35 AM
#8
Keep Calm Chive ON
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Boeing's Plastic Jet Button Pusher - 787
Posts: 2,086
I know the info from the Union has been sparse, but let's look at the information first before we get our panties in a bunch.
- Do you think the company can respond to our financial proposals if they don't even know each other's financials?
- Should the union spend some time going over the NPDM and considering how it affects our contract before negotiating our work rules?
- Considering these alone, was Oct 5 ever a realistic deadline?
That date was SET (back late July/beginning of Aug) prior to the recent release of the "proposed" NPDM rules. The landscape has changed (or maybe changing) depending on how much of the proposal is made 'good'. In addition to that, there has been some "Anti-Trust" related topics at the table that couldn't be discussed in the present 'talks' till after the Oct 1st date. In view of just those two items, it's no surprise that Oct 5th will most likely come & go without a TA to hand to our respective MEC's for review......Is it the end of the world/the sky's falling?? Nope, far from it.
What many of us are overlooking.....In order for Jeff and the New UAL to execute all the talked about "synergies" that the investors will be wanting to see/promised by way of this merger, they (the company & it's shareholders) WILL need to have a Pilot Group JCBA (and SLI) completed to deliver the numbers touted during the pre-merger talk/propaganda. The ball's in their court to a certain extent....If there are 'large'/lucrative 'synergies' to be had as the talking heads have touched on, then we (the NEW Pilot Group) have skin in the deal to share in it's payout's via the new/lucrative JCBA.
The pieces are in place.....be patient & let the game play out. Not discounting the importance of this JCBA for the NEW Pilot group, but I for one STILL like our present position in the 'game'.
Last edited by SoCalGuy; 09-25-2010 at 08:48 AM.
09-25-2010, 10:14 AM
#9
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Joined APC: Mar 2006
Posts: 20
I flew with a captain last week who recently spoke with union rep. the rep said we probably won't see a contract until mid summer at the earliest. It's just a second hand rumor so take it for what it's worth. The company has all the time in the world and they see Delta + $1 as a fair, reasonable even generous offer. They are mistaken that no part of this contract will be concessionary in any way.
09-25-2010, 11:36 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 124
At FedEx, it was Delta + a nickel, a buck, wow, ...20 times the offer! Mgt must laugh when they make us those offers. Must we compare our worth to some other "standard" such as Delta. Maybe we all should determine our own worth based specifics relating to our own company and current realities.
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