indytestdude

Dear CAL and UAL Pilots,

UAL currently uses 18 non-ALPA pilots to do all MX flying. As part of the new contract these non-ALPA positions need to be eliminated. Not as big as Scope, but they are taking your jobs!

Sonny Crockett

Hopefully they will go!

CheapFlyer

Taking our jobs? Do you really want to get called out on reserve at 2am to do an airborne flap test? Really?

Groundhog

He is refering to the cadre of engineering pilots who fly the aircraft overseas to the outsourced mx operations for inspections and maintenance.
As for a "2am ...flap test", yes. If it is a flight that can safely be performed by a line pilot, then it needs to be flown by line pilots. Scope is scope, and we need to make sure that all of the flying is protected.
Hog.

757Driver

Pretty sure we still have a group that does it out of LAX as well.

757Driver

Pretty sure we still have a group that does it out of LAX as well.

Captain Bligh

We may have to further define MX flying. I too believe the L.A. "gummers" still do some recovery, ferry and non revenue MX repositioning flight. Let's not forget that CAL outsources a ton of heavy MX work. The movement of aircraft to and from those outsource facilities provides for some extremely productive long haul flying.

That's worth fighting for under CAL's current CBA.

SONORA PASS

Indy,

I would rather keep the test pilot cadre. Just limit them to actual maintenance check flights. Strict contract limits restricting positioning/ferry flights should work.

Having a select group of pilots familiar with the various profiles and knowing the maintenance counterparts, is much better (and safer) than using our seniority list for these test flights.

I would suggest trying the opposite approach. Adding them to ALPA and/or giving line seniority number. This way pilots could transfer both ways (like current UAL PI system). It might work out nice. Plenty of guys who were PMCF and/or TPS qualified at CAL and UAL who may want to have the chance for a change of pace. Not to mention test guys that would like to take a turn flying the line.

Just another perspective.


SP

Captain Bligh

Great idea SP.

For what it's worth I believe most of the CAL test pilot cadre was comprised of post retirement pilots, at least before the age 60 rule change. If it's still the case that some or all of those pilots are too old to fly the line, imagine the demographics of the group once we get the age 70 rule change pushed through

strfyr51

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The Engineering/ Test Pilots fly the Double engine Changes Ferry flights with systems out or Degraded and Daignostic Test flights and system check flights into Overhaul. The Line pilots COULD fly the flights and Maintenence wouldn't mind that either Especially If they were GUARANTEED they would GO!! I've had Line Capt's at United Refuse to fly ferry flights for some inane reasons like the Auopilot was Inop or the Stby Horizon was inop. (If everything was all "PEACHY" then I wouldn't NEED a Ferry flight Now would I??) As if they were doing Us a "favor" in flying them. Contrary to popular belief on this board, Line pilots get FIRST refusal for Ferry,Verification or confirmation flights (At United) as I'm required to ask them for first refusal. I couldn't even get a line Capt to give me a few touch and Go's recently the second capt I asked almost started Drooling to do it. It's NOT like they Can't. Most of them did it in the Military. What the heck is different now?? It's my opinion they should be assigned for a week at a time to be available for ferry flights at the LEAST semi-annually.. And if the Can't or Won't then they shouldn't be FLYING at ALL!! We shouldn't even Need Engineering test pilots. Yet we Do.. Why??