Negotiations: CAL MEC update 9/10
09-10-2010, 03:19 PM
#1
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Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: 737 CAPT
Posts: 1,905
Negotiations: CAL MEC update 9/10
From Chairman Pierce's section:
I have also been in constant contact with the Joint Negotiating Committee, as we began receiving counter-proposals from management this week. You can read more about it in the Negotiating Committee update below, but the short version is: apparently management is still having a hard time coming to grips with the fact that this is not a status quo or concessionary contract.
NEGOTIATING COMMITTEE UPDATE
Last week, in conjunction with our Subject Matter Expert from Guam, we worked most of the week finalizing and presenting the Guam requirements for the JCBA. We would like to express our thanks to the Guam pilots for their input, and their SME for traveling to Denver to assist us with this process. We understand that it required a good deal of hard work, travel and time away from home. In addition to Guam, last week we passed to management a counterproposal to their last proposal on Moving.
This week, the JNC spent the better part of its time with the Flight Instructor representatives from both CAL and UAL to draft the proposal for Section 23 – Instructors, of the new JCBA. Also this week the JNC received counterproposals on Section 4 - Expenses and Section 11- Vacation from management. Although it is still early in negotiations, the JNC was disappointed with the Company’s Vacation counterproposal. While management’s proposals on previous sections of the JCBA have been consistent with their stated desire to reach relatively prompt agreement, their vacation proposal falls well short of that goal. We hope that the Company is not reverting to concessionary type negotiating of days past to pay for the merger of the future.
While the Transition and Process Agreement makes mention of reaching a JCBA by October 12, 2010 (Section 2, paragraph K), this is not a deadline. Instead, it is a trigger that permits the parties to apply to the NMB for mediation (unless the parties agree not to). While the goal of the JNC is to complete the JCBA in relatively quick fashion, it will not accept any substandard or concessionary agreement for the purpose of expediency.
I have also been in constant contact with the Joint Negotiating Committee, as we began receiving counter-proposals from management this week. You can read more about it in the Negotiating Committee update below, but the short version is: apparently management is still having a hard time coming to grips with the fact that this is not a status quo or concessionary contract.
NEGOTIATING COMMITTEE UPDATE
Last week, in conjunction with our Subject Matter Expert from Guam, we worked most of the week finalizing and presenting the Guam requirements for the JCBA. We would like to express our thanks to the Guam pilots for their input, and their SME for traveling to Denver to assist us with this process. We understand that it required a good deal of hard work, travel and time away from home. In addition to Guam, last week we passed to management a counterproposal to their last proposal on Moving.
This week, the JNC spent the better part of its time with the Flight Instructor representatives from both CAL and UAL to draft the proposal for Section 23 – Instructors, of the new JCBA. Also this week the JNC received counterproposals on Section 4 - Expenses and Section 11- Vacation from management. Although it is still early in negotiations, the JNC was disappointed with the Company’s Vacation counterproposal. While management’s proposals on previous sections of the JCBA have been consistent with their stated desire to reach relatively prompt agreement, their vacation proposal falls well short of that goal. We hope that the Company is not reverting to concessionary type negotiating of days past to pay for the merger of the future.
While the Transition and Process Agreement makes mention of reaching a JCBA by October 12, 2010 (Section 2, paragraph K), this is not a deadline. Instead, it is a trigger that permits the parties to apply to the NMB for mediation (unless the parties agree not to). While the goal of the JNC is to complete the JCBA in relatively quick fashion, it will not accept any substandard or concessionary agreement for the purpose of expediency.
01-26-2012, 08:20 PM
#5
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Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,866
IAH Family Awareness
From another board:
Despite the weather in IAH yesterday, The event was well attended with about 100 or so.
Pierce was there and did a question and answer session for about an hour. Here are the highlights:
Says he and Jay Heppner talk regularly - about 15 calls between the two of them yesterday
80% done with scheduling, company has changed approach. Started negotiations with UAL work rules as baseline and went from there. Says they did incorporate some items to satisfy CAL pilots need to work a lot, like picking up time ( when there are no pilots out on furlough) to increase pay. Is entirely voluntary on pilot's part. Pilot will own schedule and company is restricted from unilateral reassignments. Reserves at CAL will see huge QOL improvements. Some improvements for UAL side as well.
Re: TPA expiration and new bases - will likely happen. Union is trying to negotiate to stop it, but does not believe possible to stop new bases. Trying to make it voluntary to staff.
Working on base closure protections - protect small bases from closure like CLE and SEA
Bullish (his words) on contract in 2012 due to company making small overtures. Says Smisek is beginning to understand the pilots and other employees are not happy. Envision us working under new contract and SLI by 1st quarter 2013.
CAL will continue to hire
Was asked if SOC was going to muddy waters wrt scope? Said Single Coding was biggest threat to monitoring. Both MEC's have set up a Joint Task Force to address single coding and protect both sides scope clauses. Said CO mgt early on put in writing that they know they have to respect the CAL Scope clauses and JP felt that was good protection
External pressures on completing a contract: JP said the lack of any real new positives for the company to announce publicly or to banks was significant pressure.
I asked if both MEC's were committed to final language for pilots to vote upon? He said he would not speak for UAL MEC, but the CAL MEC is committed to final language with sufficient time to distribute, read and discusss prior to voting. Said anything less would not be entertained by CAL MEC and felt he would be hung by the CAL pilot group.
RJ's - 50 seat no longer viable so no need to waste negotiating capital on it. "Nobody" (did not elaborate if company was included in that) is arguing that 90 seat WILL be flown by us, inhouse. Big issue to be determined is what happens to 70 seat.
Contract will have retro (or maybe called something else) up to at or near 100%.
Best to settle contract before AMR 1113 completed ( about 9 months).
DC plan improvement for both groups.
Pilots frustrated with ALPA - new billboard going up in IAH - something like " United Continental Merger - DELAYED"
Contract 2-3 year length
Pay increases after amendable date - not likely - very hard to negotiate. Try to get "me too" clause - tie to other carriers pilot wages. I.e. if after the amendable date another carrier gets a raise, we get the same %, etc...
Despite the weather in IAH yesterday, The event was well attended with about 100 or so.
Pierce was there and did a question and answer session for about an hour. Here are the highlights:
Says he and Jay Heppner talk regularly - about 15 calls between the two of them yesterday
80% done with scheduling, company has changed approach. Started negotiations with UAL work rules as baseline and went from there. Says they did incorporate some items to satisfy CAL pilots need to work a lot, like picking up time ( when there are no pilots out on furlough) to increase pay. Is entirely voluntary on pilot's part. Pilot will own schedule and company is restricted from unilateral reassignments. Reserves at CAL will see huge QOL improvements. Some improvements for UAL side as well.
Re: TPA expiration and new bases - will likely happen. Union is trying to negotiate to stop it, but does not believe possible to stop new bases. Trying to make it voluntary to staff.
Working on base closure protections - protect small bases from closure like CLE and SEA
Bullish (his words) on contract in 2012 due to company making small overtures. Says Smisek is beginning to understand the pilots and other employees are not happy. Envision us working under new contract and SLI by 1st quarter 2013.
CAL will continue to hire
Was asked if SOC was going to muddy waters wrt scope? Said Single Coding was biggest threat to monitoring. Both MEC's have set up a Joint Task Force to address single coding and protect both sides scope clauses. Said CO mgt early on put in writing that they know they have to respect the CAL Scope clauses and JP felt that was good protection
External pressures on completing a contract: JP said the lack of any real new positives for the company to announce publicly or to banks was significant pressure.
I asked if both MEC's were committed to final language for pilots to vote upon? He said he would not speak for UAL MEC, but the CAL MEC is committed to final language with sufficient time to distribute, read and discusss prior to voting. Said anything less would not be entertained by CAL MEC and felt he would be hung by the CAL pilot group.
RJ's - 50 seat no longer viable so no need to waste negotiating capital on it. "Nobody" (did not elaborate if company was included in that) is arguing that 90 seat WILL be flown by us, inhouse. Big issue to be determined is what happens to 70 seat.
Contract will have retro (or maybe called something else) up to at or near 100%.
Best to settle contract before AMR 1113 completed ( about 9 months).
DC plan improvement for both groups.
Pilots frustrated with ALPA - new billboard going up in IAH - something like " United Continental Merger - DELAYED"
Contract 2-3 year length
Pay increases after amendable date - not likely - very hard to negotiate. Try to get "me too" clause - tie to other carriers pilot wages. I.e. if after the amendable date another carrier gets a raise, we get the same %, etc...
Last edited by APC225; 01-27-2012 at 04:12 AM.
01-27-2012, 03:39 PM
#6
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Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Cap
Posts: 2,282
From another board:
Despite the weather in IAH yesterday, The event was well attended with about 100 or so.
Pierce was there and did a question and answer session for about an hour. Here are the highlights:
Says he and Jay Heppner talk regularly - about 15 calls between the two of them yesterday
80% done with scheduling, company has changed approach. Started negotiations with UAL work rules as baseline and went from there. Says they did incorporate some items to satisfy CAL pilots need to work a lot, like picking up time ( when there are no pilots out on furlough) to increase pay. Is entirely voluntary on pilot's part. Pilot will own schedule and company is restricted from unilateral reassignments. Reserves at CAL will see huge QOL improvements. Some improvements for UAL side as well.
Re: TPA expiration and new bases - will likely happen. Union is trying to negotiate to stop it, but does not believe possible to stop new bases. Trying to make it voluntary to staff.
Working on base closure protections - protect small bases from closure like CLE and SEA
Bullish (his words) on contract in 2012 due to company making small overtures. Says Smisek is beginning to understand the pilots and other employees are not happy. Envision us working under new contract and SLI by 1st quarter 2013.
CAL will continue to hire
Was asked if SOC was going to muddy waters wrt scope? Said Single Coding was biggest threat to monitoring. Both MEC's have set up a Joint Task Force to address single coding and protect both sides scope clauses. Said CO mgt early on put in writing that they know they have to respect the CAL Scope clauses and JP felt that was good protection
External pressures on completing a contract: JP said the lack of any real new positives for the company to announce publicly or to banks was significant pressure.
I asked if both MEC's were committed to final language for pilots to vote upon? He said he would not speak for UAL MEC, but the CAL MEC is committed to final language with sufficient time to distribute, read and discusss prior to voting. Said anything less would not be entertained by CAL MEC and felt he would be hung by the CAL pilot group.
RJ's - 50 seat no longer viable so no need to waste negotiating capital on it. "Nobody" (did not elaborate if company was included in that) is arguing that 90 seat WILL be flown by us, inhouse. Big issue to be determined is what happens to 70 seat.
Contract will have retro (or maybe called something else) up to at or near 100%.
Best to settle contract before AMR 1113 completed ( about 9 months).
DC plan improvement for both groups.
Pilots frustrated with ALPA - new billboard going up in IAH - something like " United Continental Merger - DELAYED"
Contract 2-3 year length
Pay increases after amendable date - not likely - very hard to negotiate. Try to get "me too" clause - tie to other carriers pilot wages. I.e. if after the amendable date another carrier gets a raise, we get the same %, etc...
Despite the weather in IAH yesterday, The event was well attended with about 100 or so.
Pierce was there and did a question and answer session for about an hour. Here are the highlights:
Says he and Jay Heppner talk regularly - about 15 calls between the two of them yesterday
80% done with scheduling, company has changed approach. Started negotiations with UAL work rules as baseline and went from there. Says they did incorporate some items to satisfy CAL pilots need to work a lot, like picking up time ( when there are no pilots out on furlough) to increase pay. Is entirely voluntary on pilot's part. Pilot will own schedule and company is restricted from unilateral reassignments. Reserves at CAL will see huge QOL improvements. Some improvements for UAL side as well.
Re: TPA expiration and new bases - will likely happen. Union is trying to negotiate to stop it, but does not believe possible to stop new bases. Trying to make it voluntary to staff.
Working on base closure protections - protect small bases from closure like CLE and SEA
Bullish (his words) on contract in 2012 due to company making small overtures. Says Smisek is beginning to understand the pilots and other employees are not happy. Envision us working under new contract and SLI by 1st quarter 2013.
CAL will continue to hire
Was asked if SOC was going to muddy waters wrt scope? Said Single Coding was biggest threat to monitoring. Both MEC's have set up a Joint Task Force to address single coding and protect both sides scope clauses. Said CO mgt early on put in writing that they know they have to respect the CAL Scope clauses and JP felt that was good protection
External pressures on completing a contract: JP said the lack of any real new positives for the company to announce publicly or to banks was significant pressure.
I asked if both MEC's were committed to final language for pilots to vote upon? He said he would not speak for UAL MEC, but the CAL MEC is committed to final language with sufficient time to distribute, read and discusss prior to voting. Said anything less would not be entertained by CAL MEC and felt he would be hung by the CAL pilot group.
RJ's - 50 seat no longer viable so no need to waste negotiating capital on it. "Nobody" (did not elaborate if company was included in that) is arguing that 90 seat WILL be flown by us, inhouse. Big issue to be determined is what happens to 70 seat.
Contract will have retro (or maybe called something else) up to at or near 100%.
Best to settle contract before AMR 1113 completed ( about 9 months).
DC plan improvement for both groups.
Pilots frustrated with ALPA - new billboard going up in IAH - something like " United Continental Merger - DELAYED"
Contract 2-3 year length
Pay increases after amendable date - not likely - very hard to negotiate. Try to get "me too" clause - tie to other carriers pilot wages. I.e. if after the amendable date another carrier gets a raise, we get the same %, etc...
I got this forwarded to me. Seems like two very different messages from the same guy. Personally, I believe the one where he says the company is continuing to refuse to play ball.....
01-28-2012, 04:37 AM
#7
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Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 32
If the other message you're referring to is the one at the start of this thread, you should realize that they were written a year and 4 months apart. It looks like some progress is finally being made.
01-28-2012, 08:08 AM
#9
SLI best wishes!
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Position: B767 Capt
Posts: 399
Well it is obvious that JP tells the people in the room exactly what they want hear. What better way to illustrate this than using his own words. Lets see what he has to say in FLL next week, more of the same I guess..Maybe Garry K. will be there and we could have a good exchange.
Last edited by LeeMat; 01-28-2012 at 09:14 AM.
01-28-2012, 12:34 PM
#10
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Posts: 2,282
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