Ace66

It's in the FOM! Does the captain have to tell the FO every little thing before the FO does it? "Oh you wanted me to wear my uniform on this trip. Well I'm not a psychic - you should have texted that you wanted me to wear my uniform!"

Grumble

FOM dictates first leg of the pairing crew SHOULD meet in the CPO/FPA to brief, unless the CAPTAIN directs otherwise. If you’re an FO, and decide to take it upon yourself to go to the jet in lieu of any further direction or circumstance… you’re wrong.

Hedley

Actually it says shall meet in the FPA unless coordinated differently by the captain. Simply text the FO and tell them to meet at the plane. Being that 95% of the crew room briefings that I have witnessed were more of a BS session than an operational brief, going to ops and asking about where they live, married, kids.......... accomplishes nothing. A simple text to meet at the plane is fully compliant with the FOM.

If a captain doesn't text their FO and then doesn't go to the the FPA, then they'd be in the wrong. Also rude to the person you're flying with.

If a captain insists on meeting in the crew room, the FO probably thinks they are a tool and will not listen while the captain tries to "mentor".

If a captain text their FO to meet at the plane, not only will the FO not think that they are a tool, but the crew and passengers will be greatful that they chose to have the exact same meaningless conversation in a seat where they can ensure that the APU is up and running because the ground air sucks.

Grumble

I stand corrected, you are right. Which even more solidifies the point. If your first act as an FO on the first leg of a pairing is to violate the FOM, then don’t be mad at the repercussions.

As with most rules and regs in aviation, they’re usually founded by safety data if not downright written in blood. Even if the brief is just a BS session it serves a purpose for the two pilots to start building a rapport and for the Captain to set the tone. In the jet when your mind should be focused on the task at hand especially on the first leg is not the time and there is plenty of safety and accident data to back up the FOM mandate. The CAs I flew with who don’t meet in the per the FOM were either SCABS (not welcome down there), problem children…. Or had a valid excuse and coordinated it ahead of time. Habitually starting a trip by setting a tone of willful negligence is not a trait anyone should emulate.

Lenticularis

If you know the FO, have flown together previously and nothing significant about the flight meet at the gate. New person with a probationary report waiting in PM, technical flight? Of course let's take a look at it together in the FPA. Usually there is a reason for the choice of space to conduct a brief. I always comm the fo where to meet and if it's the FPA, I like to grab em a coffee on the way to the jet. Sounds fn terrible to me! personally I don't like getting in a jet with someone that has 200 hrs jet experience and finding out such facts 40 minutes from departure. Helps setting your mind for what you're dealing with. We have a generation landing here that seems to not have much respect for those that came before us and the precedent of professionalism. We have it good, a bit of effort will keep it good.

ThumbsUp

You are allowed to coordinate to meet at the gate, at the Starbucks, Dunkin’ Donuts… wherever. Any excuse is valid because you don’t need one.

Joeschmo

I’m a Effo based in IAH…I’ve never met a CA in the FPA

Hedley

Can you provide data that shows that meeting in the FPA inhances safety? Is there measurable data that shows that briefing in the FPA for one flight and then somewhere else for every other leg has an impact on safety? Considering that UAL is the only carrier that meets in a remote location for the first flight, is there data that shows that UAL has a noticeablly better safety record than our peers? Does it actually affect safety, or is it just a cultural norm from years ago? My position is that the content of the brief is what matters, not the location.

Practically every meeting that I have either witnessed or sat in on in the FPA was more of a bull session. 5-10 minutes of where do you live, kids, married, how's the commute........, and then a quick "are you ok with the fuel or see any issues?" before walking to a hot airplane and getting there just prior to boarding passengers. Both meeting in the FPA and anywhere else the captain decides is fully compliant with our FOM. As the captain, pick which one you prefer (if not going to the FPA have the courtesy to tell who you're flying with to save them a trip). As the FO, if not notified by the captain, go to the FPA.

Hedley

Not wanting to start a legacy this or that debate, but meeting in ops was the norm at UA prior to the merger. The norm at CAL was to meet at the plane. Culturally there are still a few holdover traditions at various bases. More people in LUAL bases still meet in ops than at LCAL bases. Being that both groups of pilots are either moving up to the WB's or retiring, I think that it is a practice that will fade away as the old is replaced with the new. I personally have never had a FO ask why I don't meet in ops, but I've had many thank me for the text and for meeting at the plane.

Pilot4000

Your mind is more "settled" because you met in the FPA vs at the airplane? What about the 15 min you wasted walking to the airplane that could have been spent on a mind settling conversation in the airplane?

I don't fly for United, but if I did this seems like something that should get changed.