Maui 777
08-14-2023, 08:32 AM
#91
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,873
It provides no hearing protection and results in both pilots yelling into each other’s most hearing damaged ear.
they’ve done studies, even in “quiet” aircraft like the Airbus pilots hearing in their open ear is generally worse than the one protected by the ear dic.
Every single communication related snafu I have had here has been with pilots using the ear dic. Every single one. I am not a soft talker either.
It needs to get added to the FSAP form and ALPA needs to start taking hearing loss/communication seriously.
they’ve done studies, even in “quiet” aircraft like the Airbus pilots hearing in their open ear is generally worse than the one protected by the ear dic.
Every single communication related snafu I have had here has been with pilots using the ear dic. Every single one. I am not a soft talker either.
It needs to get added to the FSAP form and ALPA needs to start taking hearing loss/communication seriously.
If they take them ALL out of the airplanes and issue me a Bose I will use em. Until then, freedom of choice is my vote.
08-14-2023, 08:38 AM
#92
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 1,957
Ok, freedom of choice, I’ll wear my headset then. You can yell over my hearing protection if you have something important to say.
08-14-2023, 09:58 AM
#94
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2018
Posts: 175
I really wish they'd hurry up and make this a requirement. Everyone uses a headset anyway, even the crusty b00mer types who make $300k but can't be bothered to spend any money on a decent headset.
The only seriously unsafe things I've dealt with at UAL were exactly for this reason. Crusty dudes refusing to use intercom, either can't hear me or can't hear ATC, whatever. It's a huge safety issue, and I'm sure the subject of many an FSAP. The sooner they put this into SOP, the better. There is zero reason to not use the technology, especially when communicating is the single most important thing we do in CRM.
The only seriously unsafe things I've dealt with at UAL were exactly for this reason. Crusty dudes refusing to use intercom, either can't hear me or can't hear ATC, whatever. It's a huge safety issue, and I'm sure the subject of many an FSAP. The sooner they put this into SOP, the better. There is zero reason to not use the technology, especially when communicating is the single most important thing we do in CRM.
08-14-2023, 04:09 PM
#95
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2022
Posts: 34
I really wish they'd hurry up and make this a requirement. Everyone uses a headset anyway, even the crusty b00mer types who make $300k but can't be bothered to spend any money on a decent headset.
The only seriously unsafe things I've dealt with at UAL were exactly for this reason. Crusty dudes refusing to use intercom, either can't hear me or can't hear ATC, whatever. It's a huge safety issue, and I'm sure the subject of many an FSAP. The sooner they put this into SOP, the better. There is zero reason to not use the technology, especially when communicating is the single most important thing we do in CRM.
The only seriously unsafe things I've dealt with at UAL were exactly for this reason. Crusty dudes refusing to use intercom, either can't hear me or can't hear ATC, whatever. It's a huge safety issue, and I'm sure the subject of many an FSAP. The sooner they put this into SOP, the better. There is zero reason to not use the technology, especially when communicating is the single most important thing we do in CRM.
And BTW, you'll most likely be a crusty pilot someday, so tread lightly 😂
08-14-2023, 08:17 PM
#97
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Joined APC: Feb 2015
Posts: 1,180
08-15-2023, 03:48 AM
#98
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Position: EWR 777 Captain
Posts: 1,715
Immediately following the SLI I took a bid from IAD to EWR and was one of the earliest UAL pilots to fly with an all CAL crew on a CAL airplane. When I showed up at the plane there was no mini-tel and I had to ask maintenance to bring one up. Subsequently I learned that at CAL pilots purchased their own headset. I bought a headset for myself ( Telex Airman 8) and have worn one ever since. I much prefer sharing my own kudeees on the mic then the kudeees of other UAL pilots 
but seriously I agree we should all use headsets. Trouble is our FOM is still beholden to "Gold Standards" UAL acquired from the Pan Am era. I remember one FO complaining about a UAL legacy captain who is very high in ALPA even today who would berate her for wanting to use the intercom and explain how her use of a headset was dangerous as it reduced her awareness of ambient noise. That's the heart of the problem as regards headsets - old dudes from my generation who seemingly have a hard time learning new tricks 
and don't even get me started on cross tuning in the triple which some silly UAL pilots still forbid - unbelievable!
FOM 17.10.1
but seriously I agree we should all use headsets. Trouble is our FOM is still beholden to "Gold Standards" UAL acquired from the Pan Am era. I remember one FO complaining about a UAL legacy captain who is very high in ALPA even today who would berate her for wanting to use the intercom and explain how her use of a headset was dangerous as it reduced her awareness of ambient noise. That's the heart of the problem as regards headsets - old dudes from my generation who seemingly have a hard time learning new tricks and don't even get me started on cross tuning in the triple which some silly UAL pilots still forbid - unbelievable!FOM 17.10.1
A personal headset may be used on the flight deck for communication only if
approved under an FAA Technical Standard Order (TSO) for aviation use. If the
headset is of a noise-cancelling type, it will reduce background noise levels that
can diminish the volume of important environmental sounds and alarms. The
FAA cautions that these headsets may make it difficult to hear communications
between pilots, abnormal engine or mechanical sounds, aural alarms,
vibrations, and wind noises. Pilots using TSO-compliant noise-cancelling
headsets should perform an evaluation both on the ground and in flight during
normal operations to ensure their model of noise-cancelling headset allows
them to hear the sounds and alarms described above. If the pilot's model of
headset does not permit the sounds described above, it shall not be used.
approved under an FAA Technical Standard Order (TSO) for aviation use. If the
headset is of a noise-cancelling type, it will reduce background noise levels that
can diminish the volume of important environmental sounds and alarms. The
FAA cautions that these headsets may make it difficult to hear communications
between pilots, abnormal engine or mechanical sounds, aural alarms,
vibrations, and wind noises. Pilots using TSO-compliant noise-cancelling
headsets should perform an evaluation both on the ground and in flight during
normal operations to ensure their model of noise-cancelling headset allows
them to hear the sounds and alarms described above. If the pilot's model of
headset does not permit the sounds described above, it shall not be used.
08-15-2023, 06:17 AM
#99
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2019
Posts: 1,964
Immediately following the SLI I took a bid from IAD to EWR and was one of the earliest UAL pilots to fly with an all CAL crew on a CAL airplane. When I showed up at the plane there was no mini-tel and I had to ask maintenance to bring one up. Subsequently I learned that at CAL pilots purchased their own headset. I bought a headset for myself ( Telex Airman 8) and have worn one ever since. I much prefer sharing my own kudeees on the mic then the kudeees of other UAL pilots but seriously I agree we should all use headsets. Trouble is our FOM is still beholden to "Gold Standards" UAL acquired from the Pan Am era. I remember one FO complaining about a UAL legacy captain who is very high in ALPA even today who would berate her for wanting to use the intercom and explain how her use of a headset was dangerous as it reduced her awareness of ambient noise. That's the heart of the problem as regards headsets - old dudes from my generation who seemingly have a hard time learning new tricks and don't even get me started on cross tuning in the triple which some silly UAL pilots still forbid - unbelievable!
FOM 17.10.1
but seriously I agree we should all use headsets. Trouble is our FOM is still beholden to "Gold Standards" UAL acquired from the Pan Am era. I remember one FO complaining about a UAL legacy captain who is very high in ALPA even today who would berate her for wanting to use the intercom and explain how her use of a headset was dangerous as it reduced her awareness of ambient noise. That's the heart of the problem as regards headsets - old dudes from my generation who seemingly have a hard time learning new tricks and don't even get me started on cross tuning in the triple which some silly UAL pilots still forbid - unbelievable!FOM 17.10.1
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