Remember the limits are different overseas
08-02-2023, 08:28 AM
#21
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Yet that never seems to happen. Maybe it's because they were drinking together? Maybe the other pilots want to be a bro and not cause problems for him. Maybe the rest of the crew didn't notice. Maybe they figure it will be fine, let's just get out of here. Probably not the first time either, and when this happens, usually the pilot who gets busted is a known factor. They just finally pushed it too far.
Best approach is not to get hammered on overnights, and stop at a reasonable time, well before FAR limits.
Best approach is not to get hammered on overnights, and stop at a reasonable time, well before FAR limits.
08-02-2023, 09:16 AM
#22
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For most of us, saying something like “I just don’t drink at all on short overnights” is a pretty simple & straightforward decision. But alcoholism is a real disease that involves- among other things- a lot of self-deception. That doesn’t forgive or justify putting people’s lives in danger; but judging an alcoholic’s decisions from the lens of someone who can have a drink now & then and not even think about it the rest of the time is kind of pointless.
08-02-2023, 09:28 AM
#23
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Not claiming to know any specifics but flying under the influence is so wholly devastating to an airline pilot’s career that when this does happen I tend to assume we’re not dealing with someone for whom it was a simple matter of knowing when to have that last drink. More like knowing how.
For most of us, saying something like “I just don’t drink at all on short overnights” is a pretty simple & straightforward decision. But alcoholism is a real disease that involves- among other things- a lot of self-deception. That doesn’t forgive or justify putting people’s lives in danger; but judging an alcoholic’s decisions from the lens of someone who can have a drink now & then and not even think about it the rest of the time is kind of pointless.
For most of us, saying something like “I just don’t drink at all on short overnights” is a pretty simple & straightforward decision. But alcoholism is a real disease that involves- among other things- a lot of self-deception. That doesn’t forgive or justify putting people’s lives in danger; but judging an alcoholic’s decisions from the lens of someone who can have a drink now & then and not even think about it the rest of the time is kind of pointless.
08-02-2023, 09:33 AM
#24
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Posts: 598
That's pretty moot/mute/moo when the FAA automatically revokes their certificates anyhow. But Europeans will be Europeans. I assume they will ban them from entry, like Canada does with DUIs, which accomplishes the same thing.
08-02-2023, 09:35 AM
#25
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Yes, there's that too. They may not even feel drunk when their BAC is well above the limits. But they still have other symptoms like odor, bloodshot eyes, etc. That's why the security people catch them. They know what to look for. If you have any LEO buddies, ask them all about this.
08-02-2023, 09:39 AM
#26
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Most of these guys got away with with it that way for years until they finally got caught.
08-02-2023, 09:52 AM
#27
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I just hate that some people place some expectation on the rest of the crew to catch it. If I notice I’ll try to help but I’m not going to field sobriety test the rest of the crew in the van.
08-02-2023, 10:22 AM
#28
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08-02-2023, 12:10 PM
#29
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and the FAA lost their reputation as a trustworthy gold standard with the MAX debacle
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