200 CA Vacancies in 23-10V
06-20-2023, 10:44 AM
#71
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,244
Originally Posted by WaterRooster;[url=tel:3652761
3652761]And that there is the problem. They all want to complain about upgrades all while getting theirs. I will say I used to think that the new generation of pilots were the "All about me" generation, but after coming here, I can see that they are not the first generation to be like that. The amount of senior pilots that would bend you over the barrel to get themselves ahead is astounding. I get it... They had a hard go. Furloughs, bad economics etc... But what about trying to not let it happen to those behind you? They seem to lack that understanding. Oh well.... Guess Ill start picking up PP at 50% since we are all about ourselves....
Its the whole reason we have unfilled CA vacancies to begin with. There aren’t any baby boomers bypassing NB CA upgrade, most of them took the first left seat they could hold. These younger pilots value things far more important, it’s the entire reason mgmt doesn’t know what to do, and why the old pilots are so flabbergasted we’ve had so many unfilled Ca vacancies for so many years.
06-20-2023, 11:27 AM
#72
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2018
Posts: 146
I’ll mildly disagree. The more I fly with millennials the more I realize how much more collaborative they are and how little they value (as a group) the things that make the boomers toxic. They’re receptive to mentorship about why to do and not do things in the current climate. Some how it’s the old pilots that keep winding up on FA TikTok videos, handing out drinks, playing top gun music during their PAs, etc. I see a great number of older pilots not wearing lanyards than the younger ones. It’s not just here either. FedEx and Dal had their older groups trying to pull the ladder up behind them in their most recent contract negotiations. FedEx’s current TA basically creates a B scale in retirement to benefit those on property to the expense of future new hires.
Its the whole reason we have unfilled CA vacancies to begin with. There aren’t any baby boomers bypassing NB CA upgrade, most of them took the first left seat they could hold. These younger pilots value things far more important, it’s the entire reason mgmt doesn’t know what to do, and why the old pilots are so flabbergasted we’ve had so many unfilled Ca vacancies for so many years.
Its the whole reason we have unfilled CA vacancies to begin with. There aren’t any baby boomers bypassing NB CA upgrade, most of them took the first left seat they could hold. These younger pilots value things far more important, it’s the entire reason mgmt doesn’t know what to do, and why the old pilots are so flabbergasted we’ve had so many unfilled Ca vacancies for so many years.
Generational Wealth Gap: Boomers Are 10 Times Richer Than Millennials (businessinsider.com)
There's just one set of statistics, but if you spend even 5-10 minutes, you will see that we have had FAR less earning potential, lifetime savings, etc. over the course of our adult lives. Boomer have objectively, in every metric, had a better go of it financially, 9/11, 2008 recession notwithstanding. 60-65 year old airline pilots are some of the highest earning workers in the US, let alone the world. There is zero excuse to not have saved a princely sum of money for retirement.
This doesn't even take into account the obviously declining mental and physical ability that folks have at that age. There's a huge difference between sitting in an office and flying 200+ people around. The absolute worst pilots I've flown with have been 60+. That's not to disparage all 60+ pilots, but there is a noticeable difference in attention to detail, complacency, and overall attitude between super senior CAs and new to middle age CAs. If you say otherwise, you're either lying or fooling yourself. Raising the age would again hose younger pilots aspiring to join the airlines and move up, as well as be a considerable safety risk. Everyone knows this, but yet we go around in circles about how it's not fair, blah blah blah.
But hey - we're going to have these guys try to fly their way into the grave, clutching every last dollar of premium pay as they go. They'll mumble about how hard they had it and how young whippersnappers don't understand how hard it was, despite having one of the heaviest statistical advantages in wealth that the world has ever seen.
06-20-2023, 01:23 PM
#73
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2012
Posts: 510
I’ll mildly disagree. The more I fly with millennials the more I realize how much more collaborative they are and how little they value (as a group) the things that make the boomers toxic. They’re receptive to mentorship about why to do and not do things in the current climate. Some how it’s the old pilots that keep winding up on FA TikTok videos, handing out drinks, playing top gun music during their PAs, etc. I see a great number of older pilots not wearing lanyards than the younger ones. It’s not just here either. FedEx and Dal had their older groups trying to pull the ladder up behind them in their most recent contract negotiations. FedEx’s current TA basically creates a B scale in retirement to benefit those on property to the expense of future new hires.
Its the whole reason we have unfilled CA vacancies to begin with. There aren’t any baby boomers bypassing NB CA upgrade, most of them took the first left seat they could hold. These younger pilots value things far more important, it’s the entire reason mgmt doesn’t know what to do, and why the old pilots are so flabbergasted we’ve had so many unfilled Ca vacancies for so many years.
Its the whole reason we have unfilled CA vacancies to begin with. There aren’t any baby boomers bypassing NB CA upgrade, most of them took the first left seat they could hold. These younger pilots value things far more important, it’s the entire reason mgmt doesn’t know what to do, and why the old pilots are so flabbergasted we’ve had so many unfilled Ca vacancies for so many years.
06-21-2023, 06:19 AM
#77
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2022
Posts: 311
I’ll mildly disagree. The more I fly with millennials the more I realize how much more collaborative they are and how little they value (as a group) the things that make the boomers toxic. They’re receptive to mentorship about why to do and not do things in the current climate. Some how it’s the old pilots that keep winding up on FA TikTok videos, handing out drinks, playing top gun music during their PAs, etc. I see a great number of older pilots not wearing lanyards than the younger ones. It’s not just here either. FedEx and Dal had their older groups trying to pull the ladder up behind them in their most recent contract negotiations. FedEx’s current TA basically creates a B scale in retirement to benefit those on property to the expense of future new hires.
Its the whole reason we have unfilled CA vacancies to begin with. There aren’t any baby boomers bypassing NB CA upgrade, most of them took the first left seat they could hold. These younger pilots value things far more important, it’s the entire reason mgmt doesn’t know what to do, and why the old pilots are so flabbergasted we’ve had so many unfilled Ca vacancies for so many years.
Its the whole reason we have unfilled CA vacancies to begin with. There aren’t any baby boomers bypassing NB CA upgrade, most of them took the first left seat they could hold. These younger pilots value things far more important, it’s the entire reason mgmt doesn’t know what to do, and why the old pilots are so flabbergasted we’ve had so many unfilled Ca vacancies for so many years.
06-22-2023, 12:08 AM
#78
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,244
Originally Posted by khergan;[url=tel:3653803
3653803]The reason you see so many millennials griping about boomers is that the data is very clear about how bad we have it compared to them.
Generational Wealth Gap: Boomers Are 10 Times Richer Than Millennials (businessinsider.com)
There's just one set of statistics, but if you spend even 5-10 minutes, you will see that we have had FAR less earning potential, lifetime savings, etc. over the course of our adult lives. Boomer have objectively, in every metric, had a better go of it financially, 9/11, 2008 recession notwithstanding. 60-65 year old airline pilots are some of the highest earning workers in the US, let alone the world. There is zero excuse to not have saved a princely sum of money for retirement.
This doesn't even take into account the obviously declining mental and physical ability that folks have at that age. There's a huge difference between sitting in an office and flying 200+ people around. The absolute worst pilots I've flown with have been 60+. That's not to disparage all 60+ pilots, but there is a noticeable difference in attention to detail, complacency, and overall attitude between super senior CAs and new to middle age CAs. If you say otherwise, you're either lying or fooling yourself. Raising the age would again hose younger pilots aspiring to join the airlines and move up, as well as be a considerable safety risk. Everyone knows this, but yet we go around in circles about how it's not fair, blah blah blah.
But hey - we're going to have these guys try to fly their way into the grave, clutching every last dollar of premium pay as they go. They'll mumble about how hard they had it and how young whippersnappers don't understand how hard it was, despite having one of the heaviest statistical advantages in wealth that the world has ever seen.
Generational Wealth Gap: Boomers Are 10 Times Richer Than Millennials (businessinsider.com)
There's just one set of statistics, but if you spend even 5-10 minutes, you will see that we have had FAR less earning potential, lifetime savings, etc. over the course of our adult lives. Boomer have objectively, in every metric, had a better go of it financially, 9/11, 2008 recession notwithstanding. 60-65 year old airline pilots are some of the highest earning workers in the US, let alone the world. There is zero excuse to not have saved a princely sum of money for retirement.
This doesn't even take into account the obviously declining mental and physical ability that folks have at that age. There's a huge difference between sitting in an office and flying 200+ people around. The absolute worst pilots I've flown with have been 60+. That's not to disparage all 60+ pilots, but there is a noticeable difference in attention to detail, complacency, and overall attitude between super senior CAs and new to middle age CAs. If you say otherwise, you're either lying or fooling yourself. Raising the age would again hose younger pilots aspiring to join the airlines and move up, as well as be a considerable safety risk. Everyone knows this, but yet we go around in circles about how it's not fair, blah blah blah.
But hey - we're going to have these guys try to fly their way into the grave, clutching every last dollar of premium pay as they go. They'll mumble about how hard they had it and how young whippersnappers don't understand how hard it was, despite having one of the heaviest statistical advantages in wealth that the world has ever seen.
Millennials and Gen X are in the same boat, we’ve just been waiting longer and had a front row seat.
If you are saying the junior pilots hands are completely clean here, you are sadly mistaken. All the first class grandstanding PAs on my DHs have been junior captains. Yes there are unfilled vacancies, but there are still many being filled by who? Junior guys. Yes there is plenty of blame on both ends of the list.
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