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01-15-2023, 07:53 AM
#41
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2020
Posts: 66
GREAT Post.
I understand I get a bit of flak about "always" grouping pilots into 3 categories.. LUAL, LCAL and Post Merger.
History needs to be communicated here.
Prior to UPA2012, LCAL (to my understanding) did not have any sort of FSB. But I do believe we had "looser" Reassignment rules. At the same time, this was also pre 117 and I also don't think we were doing the long haul flying like we are doing now.
So, as Hedley asked- What is a solution?
I agree that FSB sucks. But why does it suck? Is it cause of the way scheduling arbitrarily assigns it? Is it because it doesnt give Add Pay? Is it because (as Pilots), some don't want to work on Reserve?
This discussion has shown that some actually don't mind it, some HATE it, and others (many) are indifferent to it.
I understand WHY we have it, just expect to be compensated for it. You put on your uniform and have to sit at the airport for a few hours, ok.. but it should net you some Add Pay (1hr).
Our Long Haul, International WideBody Trips net the company boocoo bucks (look it up, younger generation! LOL). Having a pilot(s) sitting FSB is their form of insurance. OK. But FUPM>
As someone mentioned- Would love to see the stats on
Bases breakdown on FSB
Fleets
Seats
And then, usage.
Ironically, when I look at EWR today, I see 4 pilots (on what I assume are FSB's- 13P & 10P) One A320 crew, and one 737/Guppy! crew.
Again, we can argue the merits of those 4 slots- but maybe it's a good deal for them if they get used.. or maybe it's a bad deal if they get used. Either way, they SHOULD have gotten 1 hour of ADD Pay (in my opinion) and there NEEDS to be transparency on those assignments.
Also a bit strange as they AREN'T the International stuff I thought they would be scared of canceling and need protecting. Maybe they are more worried about the massive Narrow Body flying we have and they just feel those 2 times are strategic for those aircraft..
Maybe something else we NEED to have is set FSB times and therefore, everyone knows.., m-f at 10am there's always a FSB on the the 73Guppy~ etc..
Till ILC23, be well..
Always
Motch
I understand I get a bit of flak about "always" grouping pilots into 3 categories.. LUAL, LCAL and Post Merger.
History needs to be communicated here.
Prior to UPA2012, LCAL (to my understanding) did not have any sort of FSB. But I do believe we had "looser" Reassignment rules. At the same time, this was also pre 117 and I also don't think we were doing the long haul flying like we are doing now.
So, as Hedley asked- What is a solution?
I agree that FSB sucks. But why does it suck? Is it cause of the way scheduling arbitrarily assigns it? Is it because it doesnt give Add Pay? Is it because (as Pilots), some don't want to work on Reserve?
This discussion has shown that some actually don't mind it, some HATE it, and others (many) are indifferent to it.
I understand WHY we have it, just expect to be compensated for it. You put on your uniform and have to sit at the airport for a few hours, ok.. but it should net you some Add Pay (1hr).
Our Long Haul, International WideBody Trips net the company boocoo bucks (look it up, younger generation! LOL). Having a pilot(s) sitting FSB is their form of insurance. OK. But FUPM>
As someone mentioned- Would love to see the stats on
Bases breakdown on FSB
Fleets
Seats
And then, usage.
Ironically, when I look at EWR today, I see 4 pilots (on what I assume are FSB's- 13P & 10P) One A320 crew, and one 737/Guppy! crew.
Again, we can argue the merits of those 4 slots- but maybe it's a good deal for them if they get used.. or maybe it's a bad deal if they get used. Either way, they SHOULD have gotten 1 hour of ADD Pay (in my opinion) and there NEEDS to be transparency on those assignments.
Also a bit strange as they AREN'T the International stuff I thought they would be scared of canceling and need protecting. Maybe they are more worried about the massive Narrow Body flying we have and they just feel those 2 times are strategic for those aircraft..
Maybe something else we NEED to have is set FSB times and therefore, everyone knows.., m-f at 10am there's always a FSB on the the 73Guppy~ etc..
Till ILC23, be well..
Always
Motch
Scheduling builds whatever is legal. Manipulating times for legality. On my fleet/seat you will see a combination of as many SC/FSB as they can build and assign. It doesn’t seem to matter what the flying schedule may look like or forecast weather. There are days when they have zero…because they don’t have anyone available. There are days when they’ll have a combination of 8 pilots on SC/FSB with nothing assignable because they can. There is no disincentive for them not to so they max out available pilots. In 2yrs I bet I haven’t been on 4 LCs. I’ve seen 6hr SC assignments on last day of reserve built specifically for me. If you’re local it sucks. If you commute it sucks more. If a trip is legal to assign in your RAP they’ll assign it to you rather than to someone with more crew rest. They will call you outside your phone window to see if you’ll answer it. Zero luck on early releases to catch a flight home. They will try to work you beyond your RAP. That’s reserve in a nutshell.
01-15-2023, 08:44 AM
#42
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,501
This would be one of the most important items to me if I were a prospective new hire. A huge part of QOL is schedule flexibility and to have a beautiful bright light at the end of the reserve tunnel is final piece most of us would need in order to see UAL as the obvious no-brainer destination.
This affects everyone, not just reserves. The ability to trade and drop is predicated solely on the staffing of reserves. Definitely needs to be reigned in.
01-15-2023, 03:19 PM
#43
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2022
Posts: 27
Agreed and this is exactly my point. I suppose I could’ve explained my thoughts a bit more clearly; the “beautiful bright light” would mean that after gaining enough seniority to hold a line, one could expect to be able to trade/drop since the new contract could specify rules for minimum reserve coverage. This would be a major win-win.
01-15-2023, 04:35 PM
#44
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,501
Agreed and this is exactly my point. I suppose I could’ve explained my thoughts a bit more clearly; the “beautiful bright light” would mean that after gaining enough seniority to hold a line, one could expect to be able to trade/drop since the new contract could specify rules for minimum reserve coverage. This would be a major win-win.
Gotcha. Pass it on to your reps. The guys on the NC wouldn't know a trade or drop unless it had something to do with FTFPL.
01-16-2023, 12:22 PM
#46
line slug
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Position: B777 Captain
Posts: 220
If you want anyone to look it up you should probably get closer to the correct spelling! LOL
01-16-2023, 05:57 PM
#47
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Position: 756 Left Side
Posts: 1,629
Voluntary Airport Standby (23.EE)
Offered, not forced. Seems it pays 3 hours if not used, 3 hours plus trip if used. 6 hours at the airport and need to depart immediately if used.
Also seems that their reserves got a few more days off (1 or 2 based on monthly line credit).
I understand that everyone is probably rushing to Section 3 (compensation).. but said it before-
Rate PLUS work rules PLUS soft pay PLUS Retirement = Total Compensation
let the games begin,
be interesting to see what the final numbers are (at Delta), but don’t see this failing.
Always
Motch
01-16-2023, 06:17 PM
#48
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,351
Possible unpopular opinion, I think 3 hours & pay not dependent on used/unused is in the ballpark. The TUMI 1 hour would not have been worth my time, but I’d probably pick them up from time to time at 3/per.
01-16-2023, 06:51 PM
#49
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 586
I don’t know why this would be an unpopular opinion. If there are enough people to voluntarily pickup all the FSBs for the ADD pay, then no one gets them who doesn’t actually want them. Everyone wins.
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