nene

Yeah, and that'll go over like a fart in church. What about the people who have had to endure EWR base for years?

Sunvox

I think you hit the nail on the head here, and the sentiment you espouse is the one I have heard most on the line versus what I hear on the forum. Let's not stop working for improvements, but let's also not forget where we have been as pawns of the industry.

I started a discussion on the .info forum asking the very specific question as to whether it was money or schedule that kept pilots from going to junior NB CA. Everyone on that forum agreed that for the right price they would be willing to put up with the crappy NB CA schedule, but the current rates were no where near what was needed. I see this as a genuine problem for all airlines. I asked about unfilled vacancies on the APC Delta and American forum as well and it is clear it's happening almost everywhere, including JetBlue. Seems junior folk, most of whom have spent a decade or more at regionals or in the military are rightfully wanting some decent QOL at this stage in their career or they want to be compensated for taking a QOL hit.

Bottom line I think it's the schedules that keep people from bidding, but money COULD solve the problem without changing schedules.

TFAYD

you mean everyone has a price

UALinIAH

January proved that lol. Flights cancelling because people where burned out and 100% just wasn’t enough. Now for 200% add pay, well the trips go covered lol.

SwampFoxx

I’m not sure how one could determine this, but I would like to see a breakdown of the QOL camp vs Pay camp. I know it’s not an either/or argument. It’s a balancing act. Everyone is on a spectrum. I for one, am on the far end of the QOL spectrum. With young kids at home, you couldn’t pay me enough to upgrade (within reasonable expectations at least). I know quite a few people like me, but also see many who are happy spending their life at work making tons of money and are on the far end of the Pay spectrum.

Aquaticus

We have allowed the airline to squeeze more production out of every pilot. Less reserves, lines built to high 80s, captain reserves being understaffed so flying every day or being assigned sc/fsb for shorter callout times, pool display that is rigged so no trading... CA reserves aren't being treated well and you are on drugs if you think they will make better announcements for some bs metric that management manufactured.

hummingbear

The trick is, you’re almost always going to take a QOL hit to upgrade. Even if you improve QOL issues, any individual is going to have a better QOL in a junior BES than a more senior one. A pure QOL guy is not going to upgrade even if all the current QOL issues are addressed because his relative seniority (and therefore QOL) will still be better in the right seat than the left.

Having said that, I agree it’s a spectrum & it’s sort of asinine to break it into either/or. Yes, we all have a price, and that price gets lower the better the lifestyle the assignment offers. The solution is a combination of pay & QOL; and there are any number of ways those two elements could be blended together to make it work.

Aztecsfight

+ LAX and EWR and you have a plan.

Knotcher

Yeah really.

Not sure which base you're in but sure as hell ain't any in IAH 737.

SwampFoxx

I guess what I was getting at is where at on that spectrum do the majority of pilots reside? Closer towards the QOL side or “squeeze every drop out of me you want as long as you show me the money” side? You can tell my bias in how I phrase the question. I see several posts, as the one earlier in this thread, that claim that the only solution needed is to throw money at us and the problem will be solved. I’m just one guy saying that won’t work for me. I believe those people and myself are on two opposite ends of the spectrum. I’m curious where the average is. This pathetic, insulting TA (can’t help but to disparage it every time I mention it) seemed to lean towards the money makers. It provided more ways for the company to use and abuse you and justified it by offering add pay. Was the overwhelmingly negative response because pilots value QOL items more or because the carrot wasn’t big enough. As you said, for most people the answer is both. For me the answer is you don’t have a big enough carrot to ever get me to accept a career where I’m only home 8 - 10 days a month. Am I in the majority or minority? Forgive my asaninity