Schedule Flexibility & QOL at United
05-01-2022, 09:46 AM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,320
20-30+ years ago you would be correct. We are finally are seeing an industry that can be profitable and reinvest in the biz. The years after deregulation were a test that failed miserably. The people that ran the airlines were bankers that filled they're pockets with cash and left the companies in turmoil. So if your older I can understand the negativity and skepticism towards management. But if your truly following the industry from a macro level and listening the investor calls you can clearly see that we finally have airline guys running airlines. People that are just as passionate as pilots. This is a + for us. Your head is buried in the sand if you think otherwise. Just look at the 2 years during the pandemic. American furloughed...we did not. Gets old listening to some of these old guys ***** and complain, and the last time they actually dug into financials or listened to a investor call was 20 years ago.
The aircraft our growth. Besides the handful of old Buses and 757s. Kirby has pounding the ground with same statements since he got here. We did not utilize our network. We can be the largest US airline. We have the best hubs. I could care less about what people think of him on a personal level. Just do the job and make $$$$$ so we can benefit and future pilots can benefit.
The aircraft our growth. Besides the handful of old Buses and 757s. Kirby has pounding the ground with same statements since he got here. We did not utilize our network. We can be the largest US airline. We have the best hubs. I could care less about what people think of him on a personal level. Just do the job and make $$$$$ so we can benefit and future pilots can benefit.
05-01-2022, 11:17 AM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2021
Posts: 700
I hope that you’re right. I’d love to shrink UAX and grow this place, it’s just that I’ve watched this movie too many times. One can hear “this time it’s different” only so many times before turning into a skeptic. Things will probably go great for a while, but the next kick in the teeth is out there. It always is. When it gets here, the plan will change…….like it always has before. Enjoy the two steps forward, but plan for the one step back.
05-01-2022, 01:15 PM
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2014
Posts: 805
The hedge fund butt holes that bought their way onto the board about 5 years ago and wanted to close iad and lax should keep us all on our toes. They are still out there waiting to bump the stock 20% and run... anytime big money can be made with good short term / bad long term decisions we will be at risk. There are engaged, intelligent people that lived through our turbulent past but it is hard to find them. I was a little disappointed in the way the TA discussion went with some very vocal people forming an opinion without ever reading it.
05-01-2022, 03:55 PM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Trying not to crash
Posts: 1,260
20-30+ years ago you would be correct. We are finally are seeing an industry that can be profitable and reinvest in the biz. The years after deregulation were a test that failed miserably. The people that ran the airlines were bankers that filled their pockets with cash and left the companies in turmoil. So if you're older I can understand the negativity and skepticism towards management. But if you're truly following the industry from a macro level and listening to the investor calls you can clearly see that we finally have airline guys running airlines. People that are just as passionate as pilots. This is a + for us. Your head is buried in the sand if you think otherwise. Just look at the 2 years during the pandemic. American furloughed...we did not. Gets old listening to some of these old guys ***** and complain, and the last time they actually dug into financials or listened to a investor call was 20 years ago.
The aircraft our growth. Besides the handful of old Buses and 757s. Kirby has pounding the ground with same statements since he got here. We did not utilize our network. We can be the largest US airline. We have the best hubs. I could care less about what people think of him on a personal level. Just do the job and make $$$$$ so we can benefit and future pilots can benefit.
The aircraft our growth. Besides the handful of old Buses and 757s. Kirby has pounding the ground with same statements since he got here. We did not utilize our network. We can be the largest US airline. We have the best hubs. I could care less about what people think of him on a personal level. Just do the job and make $$$$$ so we can benefit and future pilots can benefit.
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05-01-2022, 06:56 PM
#15
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2022
Position: Power Isosceles
Posts: 119
Friend is a 756 FO in LAX and said he spent a total of 3 weeks on reserve. He’s been a lineholder ever since. New hire classes of 70 pilots every week will do that. We are hiring 2,000 pilots a year for 5 years, bringing on 500 growth planes, and adding more flying than JetBlue, Spirit and Frontier combined. Captain bids on the 737 went UNFILLED on the last bid, meaning you can hold it as soon as you get off probation.
05-02-2022, 04:16 AM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2022
Posts: 140
I too long for the days where airline pilots earn a good living for the work we do. Don't let anyone tell you we barely work or the job is so easy... it is not easy by any means and takes a special kind of person to do this day in and day out.
05-12-2022, 04:53 PM
#17
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2020
Posts: 66
I’m a junior 737 CA - about 73% overall in domicile, about 90% of line holders (737 DCA), hired / furloughed in 2008.
I formerly was a senior 737 FO (10-15%).
Best pay: line holder CA. It’s impossible to fly less than 90 hours so pay is great. It’s easy to break slightly over 100-110 credit hours. Junior line holder CA is kinda like flying all your FO trips at 50% add pay.
Best QOL: senior FO. As a senior FO I could turn a week of vacation into 2+ weeks off. I could senior man and on average, my pay was about that same as a junior/reserve CA. But unlike a junior CA I never worried about getting any specific days or even weeks off. I could hustle and make junior CA pay or I could slack off and fly 9 days in a month with no vacation, but get min FO pay of 70 hrs.
Worst QOL: CA on reserve gets old quick. 18 work days per month. Every month. Rolled days off and flown into FDOs. Lots of used short calls and field standbys. Ever changing circadian rhythms. I probably could have added a couple hours of pay by volunteering for FSB or SC but I didn’t because I nearly always got used. I probably could have aggressively picked up trips and made > 73 hrs but I didn’t. And there ain’t nothing like driving to the airport at 9pm, getting called at 1030pm and released to go home, try to sleep, and show for a 10 am 4 day. Or landing from a redeye, getting called at 3pm and told to show at 430 am. I’ve had 1 day trips turn to 5 day trips. “Visiting Reserve” is the 7th level of hell.
Junior CA line holder QOL is a mixed bag. In all honesty, I am mostly able to avoid the trips that I really don’t want (BWI redeyes). But I get a ton of low credit 4 day weekend trips and a ton of extended 24-36 hour layovers in places like MEM or MAF. Every single weekend. Every single weekend. All weekend long. All the time for the next several years - I’m totally not complaining - just stating the obvious. And I get 89.9 hour lines whether I want them or not, which leaves me little wiggle room for trip trading or premium pick ups. Looking at the monthly PBS awards, that trend is likely to continue till I get a couple THOUSAND numbers more senior.
In spite of all this I’m incredibly happy as a CA and I really do enjoy the left seat. But I urge those 1-5 year folks to think carefully because they’re potentially upgrading to be on CA reserve for several years and then be a junior line holder for several more. Within that timeframe, they’re giving up those years of widebody FO or senior narrowbody FO - both of those categories have their advantages.
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I formerly was a senior 737 FO (10-15%).
Best pay: line holder CA. It’s impossible to fly less than 90 hours so pay is great. It’s easy to break slightly over 100-110 credit hours. Junior line holder CA is kinda like flying all your FO trips at 50% add pay.
Best QOL: senior FO. As a senior FO I could turn a week of vacation into 2+ weeks off. I could senior man and on average, my pay was about that same as a junior/reserve CA. But unlike a junior CA I never worried about getting any specific days or even weeks off. I could hustle and make junior CA pay or I could slack off and fly 9 days in a month with no vacation, but get min FO pay of 70 hrs.
Worst QOL: CA on reserve gets old quick. 18 work days per month. Every month. Rolled days off and flown into FDOs. Lots of used short calls and field standbys. Ever changing circadian rhythms. I probably could have added a couple hours of pay by volunteering for FSB or SC but I didn’t because I nearly always got used. I probably could have aggressively picked up trips and made > 73 hrs but I didn’t. And there ain’t nothing like driving to the airport at 9pm, getting called at 1030pm and released to go home, try to sleep, and show for a 10 am 4 day. Or landing from a redeye, getting called at 3pm and told to show at 430 am. I’ve had 1 day trips turn to 5 day trips. “Visiting Reserve” is the 7th level of hell.
Junior CA line holder QOL is a mixed bag. In all honesty, I am mostly able to avoid the trips that I really don’t want (BWI redeyes). But I get a ton of low credit 4 day weekend trips and a ton of extended 24-36 hour layovers in places like MEM or MAF. Every single weekend. Every single weekend. All weekend long. All the time for the next several years - I’m totally not complaining - just stating the obvious. And I get 89.9 hour lines whether I want them or not, which leaves me little wiggle room for trip trading or premium pick ups. Looking at the monthly PBS awards, that trend is likely to continue till I get a couple THOUSAND numbers more senior.
In spite of all this I’m incredibly happy as a CA and I really do enjoy the left seat. But I urge those 1-5 year folks to think carefully because they’re potentially upgrading to be on CA reserve for several years and then be a junior line holder for several more. Within that timeframe, they’re giving up those years of widebody FO or senior narrowbody FO - both of those categories have their advantages.
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05-12-2022, 06:10 PM
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,320
But I urge those 1-5 year folks to think carefully because they’re potentially upgrading to be on CA reserve for several years and then be a junior line holder for several more. Within that timeframe, they’re giving up those years of widebody FO or senior narrowbody FO - both of those categories have their advantages.
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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
05-13-2022, 03:38 AM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 1,860
I’d echo this. Being in control of your schedule is more important than a few more dollars, especially for those with children. The same goes for people who just retired from the military. After spending 20+ years on deployments, time at home and being in control of how much and when you work is huge. I definitely value the time I had at home with my family as a senior first much more than what I could have made chasing promotions. This is just a job, the important stuff in life is not at work.
05-13-2022, 04:14 AM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2014
Posts: 805
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