Airline payroll assistanc part of latest bill
03-11-2021, 09:00 AM
#71
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2020
Posts: 345
As an over 50 year old, i guess I’m a wanna be millennial? As I don’t get “it” with this “pay your dues”. So because I’ve been through the ESOP and bankruptcy, I should wish those junior to me have to suffer those as well?
All for one? Or not so much? Who knew that being in a union didn’t mean looking out for all of the members, but only those that have “paid their dues.” And since the various CARES acts provided funds, we have had a singular month of reduced pay. Such a hardship.
DAL will be recalling because they put 1700 on inactive status. Different approach then we did to not furloughing, but the effect was the same, to keep everyone on the property (at a reduced pay) and not furlough. If the government hadn’t stepped up and supported the airlines, UAL and Delta would have furloughed pilots (they did furlough other employee groups). American actually did furlough pilots.
Define short term. We are a year into 50% or less flying now, with international recovery still a big unknown, and will lag the domestic recovery . Vaccinations and other mitigation methods will continue to allow a return to “normal”. But when that date is, no one knows. As we have seen already, there will be spikes of cases up and then down. 2021 is basically dead, so 2022 is the bounce back year, which means it will be a two year+ effect due to the pandemic. So again, what’s your definition of short term?
All for one? Or not so much? Who knew that being in a union didn’t mean looking out for all of the members, but only those that have “paid their dues.” And since the various CARES acts provided funds, we have had a singular month of reduced pay. Such a hardship.
DAL will be recalling because they put 1700 on inactive status. Different approach then we did to not furloughing, but the effect was the same, to keep everyone on the property (at a reduced pay) and not furlough. If the government hadn’t stepped up and supported the airlines, UAL and Delta would have furloughed pilots (they did furlough other employee groups). American actually did furlough pilots.
Define short term. We are a year into 50% or less flying now, with international recovery still a big unknown, and will lag the domestic recovery . Vaccinations and other mitigation methods will continue to allow a return to “normal”. But when that date is, no one knows. As we have seen already, there will be spikes of cases up and then down. 2021 is basically dead, so 2022 is the bounce back year, which means it will be a two year+ effect due to the pandemic. So again, what’s your definition of short term?
Who knew that being in a union allowed a furlough protection agreement framework to migrate into a pandemic recovery LOA? I guess that many just don’t see it from the company’s point of view.
03-11-2021, 09:50 AM
#72
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: WB Bunkie
Posts: 1,246
It's pretty obvious that this generation just wants it without investing in it. For the pilots who are over 50 years of age here, they get it. Why? Because they had to pay their dues.
The recent LOA was a serious give to the bottom one third. I guess you don't understand that. When I say "give." I mean give. as in philanthropy. We have a great tendency to rob peter in order to pay paul. That philanthropy came from somewhere no? DAL is already recalling. The crisis was short lived.
The recent LOA was a serious give to the bottom one third. I guess you don't understand that. When I say "give." I mean give. as in philanthropy. We have a great tendency to rob peter in order to pay paul. That philanthropy came from somewhere no? DAL is already recalling. The crisis was short lived.
my point, is it is not black-and-white. You have simply drawn the line where you think is correct, meaning someone put an X, and you believe they deserve Y. I think the phrase “OK Boomer” has a lot to do with boomers looking at everyone else saying “they don’t get it,” when the Boomer is just as mad when something is taken away from them.
what is an American citizen owed, simply by virtue of being born within our borders? Protection from foreign countries, a safe interstate system, a body that regulates and polices driving ability? Healthcare? Comprehensive healthcare? Provisions to prevent senior poverty?
what about any human being? What are basic human rights?
you want to make this simple, and believe something concrete is owed to certain people… But it is not that simple. Our industry is dynamic, and things are constantly changing. Given the evolutions we have seen in CRM over the last 30 years, I think it is obvious that you do not want to be stuck in the mindset, that “this is how it is always been done, so we should honor that”
03-11-2021, 05:47 PM
#73
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2019
Posts: 1,345
I really don’t think Pete is himself over 50, nor do I think he’s in the middle or top third of the company. I just think he’s from an airline family and his loyalties to older family members are stronger than his own sense of self-preservation.
03-11-2021, 07:00 PM
#74
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,159
As an over 50 year old, i guess I’m a wanna be millennial? As I don’t get “it” with this “pay your dues”. So because I’ve been through the ESOP and bankruptcy, I should wish those junior to me have to suffer those as well?
All for one? Or not so much? Who knew that being in a union didn’t mean looking out for all of the members, but only those that have “paid their dues.” And since the various CARES acts provided funds, we have had a singular month of reduced pay. Such a hardship.
DAL will be recalling because they put 1700 on inactive status. Different approach then we did to not furloughing, but the effect was the same, to keep everyone on the property (at a reduced pay) and not furlough. If the government hadn’t stepped up and supported the airlines, UAL and Delta would have furloughed pilots (they did furlough other employee groups). American actually did furlough pilots.
Define short term. We are a year into 50% or less flying now, with international recovery still a big unknown, and will lag the domestic recovery . Vaccinations and other mitigation methods will continue to allow a return to “normal”. But when that date is, no one knows. As we have seen already, there will be spikes of cases up and then down. 2021 is basically dead, so 2022 is the bounce back year, which means it will be a two year+ effect due to the pandemic. So again, what’s your definition of short term?
All for one? Or not so much? Who knew that being in a union didn’t mean looking out for all of the members, but only those that have “paid their dues.” And since the various CARES acts provided funds, we have had a singular month of reduced pay. Such a hardship.
DAL will be recalling because they put 1700 on inactive status. Different approach then we did to not furloughing, but the effect was the same, to keep everyone on the property (at a reduced pay) and not furlough. If the government hadn’t stepped up and supported the airlines, UAL and Delta would have furloughed pilots (they did furlough other employee groups). American actually did furlough pilots.
Define short term. We are a year into 50% or less flying now, with international recovery still a big unknown, and will lag the domestic recovery . Vaccinations and other mitigation methods will continue to allow a return to “normal”. But when that date is, no one knows. As we have seen already, there will be spikes of cases up and then down. 2021 is basically dead, so 2022 is the bounce back year, which means it will be a two year+ effect due to the pandemic. So again, what’s your definition of short term?
No x wives. No alamony. Three bankrupt airlines. So have a nice day.
03-11-2021, 07:14 PM
#75
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,159
The best thing we can do is get rid of all these buckets. Senior, middle, and junior. Get everyone on their min guarantees. Just run the contract and bring everyone's pay up. The cares money should be doing that right now.
03-11-2021, 07:16 PM
#76
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Position: The GF of FUPM
Posts: 3,073
03-11-2021, 07:53 PM
#77
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2012
Posts: 456
It's really simple. The deal was the deal. Let it alone. We don't need to keep doing this and doing that. We keep tripping over ourselves to help the company. Just leave it alone. And yes, pay your dues. I haven't met a single double furloughee that thinks this was worthy of signing. Now that it's done. Just leave it the heck a lone.
No x wives. No alamony. Three bankrupt airlines. So have a nice day.
No x wives. No alamony. Three bankrupt airlines. So have a nice day.
Plenty of guys have payed plenty of dues just to show up here after 50, and they’ve got you telling them they haven’t paid their dues?
The world is bigger than you and your experience old man.
03-11-2021, 08:15 PM
#78
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,525
Everytime I read the “your generation,” arguments I think this same thing. Seems like we have mainly old and older dudes around here.
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