130shadow

Each pilot will receive a tube of lube and pack of cigs. For before and after. Just say NO

Sixty N Two

Keep swinging buddy, one of those wild punches is gonna connect

130shadow

As long as you’re ok with being subsidized by your fellow pilots, guess we should all be ok with it.

TransWorld

Just a tube of lube? Back in the old days pilots got a 55 gallon drum of lube. Why would times change?

130shadow

Amen. Bend over and accept the pain cause it’s about to come.

Sniper66

you are out of line
think before you type and not after
esop, a plan , NB captain pay versus WB FO pay in the past

130shadow

I was here for all that and with that being said, explain what that has to do this AIP

UALManager

What are you ”buying” with your TA by accepting or rejecting it? Try to really answer for yourself without looking at the answer key below. C’mon man, don’t peek yet (Joe Biden). Let me touch your hair (ok, just had to add that it has nothing to do with this but wink wink we all know what it means when old Joe says it)
What are you getting as a group in return for your money? Some of you think that it’s jobs or juniors. Really, do you think that’s what you’re buying? It’s a nice consequence but no. That’s not what you are buying. Financially, if your bottom 3-5k had no jobs for about the next 6-8 months. In fact, I’d greatly prefer they didn’t get paid, only from a purely financial standpoint. It’s nice to have happy employees too, but not at that massive cost.
What you are buying, because really you are considering “buying” something. What’s the real carrot for you?:
1. Seniority - or at least retained seniority. Thousands of seniority numbers for yourself in functional terms. What would you pay to go up 5k? That’s not perfect, but what would you pay not to drop 5k? That’s not perfect either. How bout this – what would you pay to be #8000 of 8000 pilots with no pay rate protection vs #7400 of 13000 with some of you getting some pay rate protection. Assuming 5k furlough and 600 EO. What’s really crummy is being #8001 of 8000 on your list. How much would you pay for that? Everyone’s answer is different I guess, and none are wrong, even $0.
You get a whole slew of other benefits too, but that’s the big one you’re buying. You are buying your pay/seniority going forward. One of the two (or both) is going down one way or another no matter what. I could even make the case that the junior guy is buying your higher seniority rise with his greater % income loss. It’s incorrect, but less incorrect than you thinking you’re subsidizing his junior job. Some big holes in my argument by the core is correct. I know it’ll still anger some of you to hear. If you get all blocked up about it we can send some granola bars. You're only subsidizing yourself.

Sixty N Two

I found a job. Leaving soon. Trying to decide how best to vote. You complain, ***** and moan about the carve out, got it! I’m not saying your wrong, but good god. You saying your subsidizing me is just another example of a guilt trip useless attempt to sell me. I know your type, I read your previous post. So you spent a whopping 14 mo on furlough and 9 of that in the Middle East, thank you for your sacrifice and all that. I’ve spent years over there too. I know your type, quick on the draw with an attack the moment something might affect you. I say instead of your “having” to deploy you went begging for orders to build points toward your retirement. Again, I don’t begrudge you for taking care of business and your family, smart move. But I seriously, based on your sniveling crying demeanor believe for one second that if you were unable to get orders from your guard unit and we’re looking down the barrel of a furlough with no reasonable back up plan to replace your income, doubt that you’d lose one minute sleep being subsidized by senior pilots. That is the rationale behind a yes vote, that and some believe their union is speaking for them and chose to believe this will set us up (yes at the same time benefit the company) for a better recovery and that it will be short term pain and quicker to get back to better pay/QoL. Disagree or not, but it’s a position.

In juxtaposition to your approach, there are many others who are opposed and provide constructive information (insert Mouch, Old Mako, as regulars and there are many others). I see logical arguments to yes and no, depends on how much one believes we will furlough and how deep, how long the recovery will take, also the likelihood of a merger, etc... But your sooo focused on the singular I, you lose people like me trying to learn the history and why SK and the union would both agree to something. Well forget SK, but why would TI and 15 other MECs try to hurt people? I think it’s obvious their perspective is not in keeping with many pilots wants and inputs as I read these posts.

The one single aspect of all this that bothers me most is how it’s all happening at the 11th hour. Rarely have I seen good decisions made in a rush and when driven by fear at the last minute. If this has been in the works for months why now versus a reasonable time sooner. I am taking my time and I hope you stop the guilt trip *****ing at Jr pilots (be ****ed at the MEC if anything) and help explain from your experience why it is not in our long-term benefit to vote yes. Or better yet, why you believe it IS good to vote no. Same purpose different approach. There are a lot of us trying to make a sound decision. All I heard for a long time was My Union speaks for me, so I shut up (mostly) So now what? United accord to 130Shadow. Back to the US Open.

130shadow

Holy crap are you delusional. I have self pride and would rather this place go out of business than drink the kool aid you are drinking.