Delta’s Early Out for Pilots
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2014
Posts: 805
There are pockets of demand all over the country. Domestic load factor was over 60% the past few days. Den has the highest load factors and southwest has been adding flights there for the past month while we up gauge our few flights a day. The TSA numbers aren't a lie but they are flawed. There aren't enough flights to book on and United has been cancelling too early as passengers are shifting towards a last minute booking model. With our refusal to issue refunds and only offering credit it has led to passengers holding on to their money until the week before when they hope the flight will go as scheduled. We have to be more nimble and make better decisions as an airline. We aren't going to survive if we wait for delta plus two weeks to make/copy their decision. When was the last time Kirby talked to us like Bastion just did his pilots?
#22
There are pockets of demand all over the country. Domestic load factor was over 60% the past few days. Den has the highest load factors and southwest has been adding flights there for the past month while we up gauge our few flights a day. The TSA numbers aren't a lie but they are flawed. There aren't enough flights to book on and United has been cancelling too early as passengers are shifting towards a last minute booking model. With our refusal to issue refunds and only offering credit it has led to passengers holding on to their money until the week before when they hope the flight will go as scheduled. We have to be more nimble and make better decisions as an airline. We aren't going to survive if we wait for delta plus two weeks to make/copy their decision. When was the last time Kirby talked to us like Bastion just did his pilots?
#23
weekends off? Nope...
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 2,018
You got punk'd BIG TIME!!
Do you read your contract comparisons? Let me help you out. 12 year SWA captain rate is 238 TFP and line guarantee for a 31 day month is 89. = $254k/ year. All the lines pay the same now. Throw in a little vacation overlap. There is almost no open time and even less premium flying. $285k a year for flying your line.
Do you read your contract comparisons? Let me help you out. 12 year SWA captain rate is 238 TFP and line guarantee for a 31 day month is 89. = $254k/ year. All the lines pay the same now. Throw in a little vacation overlap. There is almost no open time and even less premium flying. $285k a year for flying your line.
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 1,860
So where are all the @ss holes that were arguing that Early Outs did not make financial sense.
Sure we can use the argument that we were waiting to see what everyone else was doing before we draft our own BS.
Oh well, let’s just keep arguing about UAL/CAL SLI or PP pick up because we have become the laughing stock of the industry.
We are SH!T.
Sure we can use the argument that we were waiting to see what everyone else was doing before we draft our own BS.
Oh well, let’s just keep arguing about UAL/CAL SLI or PP pick up because we have become the laughing stock of the industry.
We are SH!T.
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,888
There are pockets of demand all over the country. Domestic load factor was over 60% the past few days. Den has the highest load factors and southwest has been adding flights there for the past month while we up gauge our few flights a day. The TSA numbers aren't a lie but they are flawed. There aren't enough flights to book on and United has been cancelling too early as passengers are shifting towards a last minute booking model. With our refusal to issue refunds and only offering credit it has led to passengers holding on to their money until the week before when they hope the flight will go as scheduled. We have to be more nimble and make better decisions as an airline. We aren't going to survive if we wait for delta plus two weeks to make/copy their decision. When was the last time Kirby talked to us like Bastion just did his pilots?
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2019
Posts: 177
So, if we come out the other side of this and SK starts trying to grow (like he did several years ago, despite Wall Street’s criticism), do you guys keep up the “I should be boss of the world” condescending negativity or do you admit that you didn’t have all the facts and were premature with your conclusions?
SK isn’t Oscar and he’s got his flaws, but following others and shrinking to profitability isn’t one of them.
SK isn’t Oscar and he’s got his flaws, but following others and shrinking to profitability isn’t one of them.
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 251
As a very very junior Oakland captain you are wrong! I avg 105 tfp and I am getting crumbs (reserve mixed with a trip here and there). Guys who don’t want to play the game get less but make no mistake we still got guys bringing in money just a little harder is all !
You got punk'd BIG TIME!!
Do you read your contract comparisons? Let me help you out. 12 year SWA captain rate is 238 TFP and line guarantee for a 31 day month is 89. = $254k/ year. All the lines pay the same now. Throw in a little vacation overlap. There is almost no open time and even less premium flying. $285k a year for flying your line.
We have a very tiny group of players in cartels who still carry around their W-2's from our retro pay contract year because as usual we went 4 years past amendable date so 4 years of retro on it. . Braggadociosly lying about our pay is part of their genetic structure for some reason, perhaps as a device to make up for other insecurities and inadequacies.
So I'm really sorry... sincerely. I wish that we had raised the bar (for once) but maybe we will at least maintain our own lagging bar in this black swan event as we did after 9/11. Hopefully that won't need to happen. Speaking of 9/11, remember right before 9/11 we were 39 percent below industry average narrow body pay.
Remember too, that we just got a B fund! We pay for our own parking. We have no long call reserve. I could go on and on and on.
Good luck to all my UAL brothers and sisters. Looking from the outside one of the positives I see is that solid retirement curve over there. The other is that your union and pilot group really have fairly consistently raised the bar and stood the ground. Thank You.
Do you read your contract comparisons? Let me help you out. 12 year SWA captain rate is 238 TFP and line guarantee for a 31 day month is 89. = $254k/ year. All the lines pay the same now. Throw in a little vacation overlap. There is almost no open time and even less premium flying. $285k a year for flying your line.
We have a very tiny group of players in cartels who still carry around their W-2's from our retro pay contract year because as usual we went 4 years past amendable date so 4 years of retro on it. . Braggadociosly lying about our pay is part of their genetic structure for some reason, perhaps as a device to make up for other insecurities and inadequacies.
So I'm really sorry... sincerely. I wish that we had raised the bar (for once) but maybe we will at least maintain our own lagging bar in this black swan event as we did after 9/11. Hopefully that won't need to happen. Speaking of 9/11, remember right before 9/11 we were 39 percent below industry average narrow body pay.
Remember too, that we just got a B fund! We pay for our own parking. We have no long call reserve. I could go on and on and on.
Good luck to all my UAL brothers and sisters. Looking from the outside one of the positives I see is that solid retirement curve over there. The other is that your union and pilot group really have fairly consistently raised the bar and stood the ground. Thank You.
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,111
You’ve really gotta try hard to just fly your line here. Just showing up increases the likelihood of reassignments and premium pay. I’m just barely on year 5 FO pay and on track to make $200k without any open time awards awards. Adding 2000 flights to the schedule over the next 2 weeks and the open time picture has changed significantly. Only way to make $254k/ year as a captain is to call out sick for the entire year.
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2012
Position: 737 CA
Posts: 508
Meh. I don't do much extra (never work more than 14 days a month) and that's about where I'm sitting as a 6 year FO. Agreed we need to improve our contract though.
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,111
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