Displacement Bid 20-07D
05-05-2020, 07:54 AM
#151
Orbis Non Sufficit
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Posts: 735
I just ran the numbers for myself yesterday and I'll be better off leaving UAL than staying, though I'm 5000 from the bottom...so like you said, life won't be fun if I'm not furloughed anyway. I can make more on the outside that I think I'll be paid to sit reserve on the Bus and then do the 4-legs to the Omaha layover. Yesterday I called the CPO and said bye and mailed in my iPad and vest. The CPO was sort of amazed a guy would check out early and gave me the "hang in there together" speech. But in good conscience I can't sit knowing I'm taking a job from someone that needs it. I wish all you guys luck. I do have a couple First Officer hats still in the bag if anyone wants one!
05-05-2020, 08:11 AM
#152
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 482
Isn’t there an “act of god” or “national emergency” clause. I’m an AA guy and we wouldn’t get $hit if we furlough..
05-05-2020, 08:21 AM
#153
On Reserve
Joined APC: May 2020
Posts: 17
I don't know...
I'd have to be honest and say I really don't care about furlough pay. As a 22 year FO pay that would be maybe ??? $75,000??? best case. If I had to sit reserve and give up my day job I'd lose at least that every year I delay. So in my case to answer your question I wouldn't factor it in because it would be irrelevant for my long term plan. All I have is history to go on and my own limited history shows to put confidence in events outside my control. The furlough pay would be outside my control.
05-05-2020, 08:26 AM
#155
On Reserve
Joined APC: May 2020
Posts: 17
Sort of like baseball...
It's for real...for me, it was like baseball its better to go out with the good memories. Right now I remember 4 or 5 years of Island layovers and great money with happy people. Having a cold one at Duke's in Lihue is as good a memory as any.
05-05-2020, 08:37 AM
#156
Orbis Non Sufficit
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Posts: 735
I'd have to be honest and say I really don't care about furlough pay. As a 22 year FO pay that would be maybe ??? $75,000??? best case. If I had to sit reserve and give up my day job I'd lose at least that every year I delay. So in my case to answer your question I wouldn't factor it in because it would be irrelevant for my long term plan. All I have is history to go on and my own limited history shows to put confidence in events outside my control. The furlough pay would be outside my control.
05-05-2020, 09:04 AM
#157
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2016
Posts: 243
Word of mouth, but this info apparently originates from inside flight ops leadership (Q&A with LCAs). To summarize:
-The company currently does NOT plan on actually displacing (read training) 4500 pilots. It is merely just the first phase of a worst case scenario battle plan to have in their back pocket
-Displacement training cycles will start June 01 from the button up. As/if the recovery improves they will cancel displacements from the top down (or on the contrary, create additional displacements)
-There are four furlough plans: 0, 1000, 4000, 8000. Still way too early to determine which is most realistic
-4500 displacements absolutely does not mean 4500 furloughs
-Anyone who’s junior and has had training cancelled does not mean they will be furloughed. The company is just trying to maximize displacement training throughput and doesn’t care if there will be “not qualled” pilots on junior fleets, since there will be such a surplus. If they have to go to the sim anyway (QMV/QLOE/landings), they’d rather kick that can down the road and re-qual them when they become needed and use the current sim slots in the near-term for Qualification courses as a result of displacements. A requal would just be a warmup, maneuvers validation, then line check.
-The current furlough breakeven estimate is 6 months based on the structure of the displacement (not 18 months as previously believed). While this may make it easier to justify furloughing X number of pilots, it is also that much earlier a pilot can expect to returning to the line should things really improve, IF a furlough even happens
-The company currently does NOT plan on actually displacing (read training) 4500 pilots. It is merely just the first phase of a worst case scenario battle plan to have in their back pocket
-Displacement training cycles will start June 01 from the button up. As/if the recovery improves they will cancel displacements from the top down (or on the contrary, create additional displacements)
-There are four furlough plans: 0, 1000, 4000, 8000. Still way too early to determine which is most realistic
-4500 displacements absolutely does not mean 4500 furloughs
-Anyone who’s junior and has had training cancelled does not mean they will be furloughed. The company is just trying to maximize displacement training throughput and doesn’t care if there will be “not qualled” pilots on junior fleets, since there will be such a surplus. If they have to go to the sim anyway (QMV/QLOE/landings), they’d rather kick that can down the road and re-qual them when they become needed and use the current sim slots in the near-term for Qualification courses as a result of displacements. A requal would just be a warmup, maneuvers validation, then line check.
-The current furlough breakeven estimate is 6 months based on the structure of the displacement (not 18 months as previously believed). While this may make it easier to justify furloughing X number of pilots, it is also that much earlier a pilot can expect to returning to the line should things really improve, IF a furlough even happens
Last edited by captsurf; 05-05-2020 at 09:26 AM.
05-05-2020, 09:38 AM
#158
On Reserve
Joined APC: May 2020
Posts: 17
Great question...
[QUOTE=Nucflash;3049451]I get you....the question is can you ride off into the sunset on LOA or COLA with no obligation to the company and still capture your dough?[/QU
For me, in my universe, no. The job I'm in will require me to quit all other employers. Right now I'm paid "per diem" as non-tenured faculty...By making the move to the tenure track I have to renounce all other work. So great question and it did cross my mind but I agreed to not work at UAL anymore after August 15th.
For me, in my universe, no. The job I'm in will require me to quit all other employers. Right now I'm paid "per diem" as non-tenured faculty...By making the move to the tenure track I have to renounce all other work. So great question and it did cross my mind but I agreed to not work at UAL anymore after August 15th.
05-05-2020, 09:38 AM
#159
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: B737 CAPT IAH
Posts: 1,130
05-05-2020, 09:41 AM
#160
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: 787
Posts: 3,202
Word of mouth, but this info apparently originates from inside flight ops leadership (Q&A with LCAs). To summarize:
-The company currently does NOT plan on actually displacing (read training) 4500 pilots. It is merely just the first phase of a worst case scenario battle plan to have in their back pocket
-Displacement training cycles will start June 01 from the button up. As/if the recovery improves they will cancel displacements from the top down (or on the contrary, create additional displacements)
-There are four furlough plans: 0, 1000, 4000, 8000. Still way too early to determine which is most realistic
-4500 displacements absolutely does not mean 4500 furloughs
-Anyone who’s junior and has had training cancelled does not mean they will be furloughed. The company is just trying to maximize displacement training throughput and doesn’t care if there will be “not qualled” pilots on junior fleets, since there will be such a surplus. If they have to go to the sim anyway (QMV/QLOE/landings), they’d rather kick that can down the road and re-qual them when they become needed and use the current sim slots in the near-term for Qualification courses as a result of displacements. A requal would just be a warmup, maneuvers validation, then line check.
-The current furlough breakeven estimate is 6 months based on the structure of the displacement (not 18 months as previously believed). While this may make it easier to justify furloughing X number of pilots, it is also that much earlier a pilot can expect to returning to the line should things really improve, IF a furlough even happens
-The company currently does NOT plan on actually displacing (read training) 4500 pilots. It is merely just the first phase of a worst case scenario battle plan to have in their back pocket
-Displacement training cycles will start June 01 from the button up. As/if the recovery improves they will cancel displacements from the top down (or on the contrary, create additional displacements)
-There are four furlough plans: 0, 1000, 4000, 8000. Still way too early to determine which is most realistic
-4500 displacements absolutely does not mean 4500 furloughs
-Anyone who’s junior and has had training cancelled does not mean they will be furloughed. The company is just trying to maximize displacement training throughput and doesn’t care if there will be “not qualled” pilots on junior fleets, since there will be such a surplus. If they have to go to the sim anyway (QMV/QLOE/landings), they’d rather kick that can down the road and re-qual them when they become needed and use the current sim slots in the near-term for Qualification courses as a result of displacements. A requal would just be a warmup, maneuvers validation, then line check.
-The current furlough breakeven estimate is 6 months based on the structure of the displacement (not 18 months as previously believed). While this may make it easier to justify furloughing X number of pilots, it is also that much earlier a pilot can expect to returning to the line should things really improve, IF a furlough even happens
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