Itsajob

You missed the point. He was saying that people tend to do what is best for themselves and not to expect someone to hold your hand.

Freight Dawg

I got his point loud and clear. If you think UAL ALPA hasn’t historically done everything reasonably possible to reduce furloughs and then support those furloughed, you are either ignorant or are unrealistically selfish.

duvie

I totally understand that for many the option to work 8-11 days and make only 5 more hours is a terrible trade. What I’m saying is that I’m sure this would go much farther to stem cash burn and change the staffing model significantly. It’s voluntary, so hardly a concession. Make it sunset as well if that helps.

a lot of people rationally conclude that the company will run roughshod over the contract, but if they are in a position to do that, IE bankruptcy, we have a lot more in our contract to worry about than a voluntary MPG provision

AxlF16

I strongly believe that Kirby will avoid bankruptcy like the plague (pun intended). Far too much risk and too little low hanging fruit for them. This is NOT 2003.

A voluntary reduction doesn't provide a known quantity for their planning and would therefore be less effective at furlough mitigation. It would also kill any SRL or ESRL offerings. It's basically asking the pilot group to pay for the UPA SRL provisions.

Do you still not see that your ideas are concessions?

duvie

I agree with all of the above.

make it 6 month or more.

Shrek

Nobody is safe from furlough in this situation.......

To say “many” aren’t going to do chit is myopic at best........there is a thing called unity and the vast majority of our pilots top to bottom are going to vote for the furlough fund. Do you think that the best long term strategy would be to gut the contract now to “save” furloughs (which doesn’t work anyways) or to hold fast on the contract and have a job worth coming back to ?

If you choose gut the contract now to “save” furloughs how do you quantify how many pilots you have “saved”? If the answer has the company said......... you got played. Pilots could work for free......no money....... and the company would furlough just as many due to insurance/401K contributions. We have gone down a version of this road before bankruptcy and it was a complete failure.

We will get through this (I am prepared for the furlough) and before long come back to a job that is worth coming back to. That is the MEC’s direction and it is the right one for all involved.

TSRAGR

What about the alcohol/drug abuse, divorces, suicides, etc. that unfortunately occur during furlough?

--Now, I agree we shouldn't break the contract and give concessions b/c it'll be a decade/ever if we get them back. But to say "it's the right one for all involved" is rather naive, IMHO. It'll be the better choice for the vast majority, but it'll break the camels back for some

LeeFXDWG

Again from another post, do not ever lower the bar in the UPA. Even if it’s a voluntary measure like LOA 20-01. It will come back to bite you in the arse day one of the BK court.

My 2 cents and believe/hope whatever you want to.

Lee

crflyer

Can someone help explain why the company would want to have lower line values long-term? Why would temporarily lower values now have any bearing on lower line values later? I see no benefit to the company in long-term lowering of line value, whether by their ask or in BK. What am I missing here? Serious question. Why would this one temporary bandaid, if you will, rip us in the future? If there’s something I’m not seeing, I’m just trying to see what it is.

ugleeual

Call your reps and plead your case... and please stop negotiating in public. Rather than discuss give always on this forum use your time wisely by talking to your FOs and tell them to get there finances in order now while they can.

Some of you ‘captains’ are filling your FOs craniums with false hope that they will be saved.... and it is only going to hurt them in the long run by holding on to this hope until the day the intern takes their company ID.