Looks like the jumpseat order got changed.
10-14-2019, 10:55 AM
#671
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 38
This thread is impressive, 65+ pages in just a few days.
In all seriousness, I don't see any way that the SKW and RH pilot groups walk away from this with anything resembling a "win". Besides denying jumpseats to a modest percentage of UAL and perhaps even UAX commuters, what else can they really do? Carpet bomb the forums with specious threats and insults I guess. Anything else?
Lots of options still available to the UA pilot group, and we can employ them from the high ground which we will continue to occupy. Our war chest hasn't been tapped in decades and is much, much bigger than that of SKW and RH combined. I wonder if the SKW and RH ringleaders/lifers have considered that DAL is a brother ALPA carrier? I imagine the APA and SWAPA would also lend us a hand if this drags out.
I flew with a CA yesterday who has often commuted on SKW over the years and knows firsthand this fight will affect him if it drags on. He said this reckoning was a "long time coming" and "overdue". He was also well connected with our MEC and didn't seem the least bit concerned about how this would ultimately end. He said our coming response would ultimately be overwhelming. I hope it doesn't come to that but won't feel bad if it does.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled mudslinging...
In all seriousness, I don't see any way that the SKW and RH pilot groups walk away from this with anything resembling a "win". Besides denying jumpseats to a modest percentage of UAL and perhaps even UAX commuters, what else can they really do? Carpet bomb the forums with specious threats and insults I guess. Anything else?
Lots of options still available to the UA pilot group, and we can employ them from the high ground which we will continue to occupy. Our war chest hasn't been tapped in decades and is much, much bigger than that of SKW and RH combined. I wonder if the SKW and RH ringleaders/lifers have considered that DAL is a brother ALPA carrier? I imagine the APA and SWAPA would also lend us a hand if this drags out.
I flew with a CA yesterday who has often commuted on SKW over the years and knows firsthand this fight will affect him if it drags on. He said this reckoning was a "long time coming" and "overdue". He was also well connected with our MEC and didn't seem the least bit concerned about how this would ultimately end. He said our coming response would ultimately be overwhelming. I hope it doesn't come to that but won't feel bad if it does.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled mudslinging...
Cool story bro!
10-14-2019, 11:22 AM
#673
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 200
They will, what's disturbing is in this memo SAPA is encouraging discord in the cockpit by suggesting First Officers actually stand up to a Captain as though this is a safety issue.
Until, as outlined is required in our FOM, an agreement is terminated by our VP of Ops., and I get an official statement of such in the form of an FOIB and FOM revision, I will take any qualified pilot on my jumpseat.
Shame SAPA has chosen to pit us against each other-I guess I'll have to make it a briefing item.
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
Until, as outlined is required in our FOM, an agreement is terminated by our VP of Ops., and I get an official statement of such in the form of an FOIB and FOM revision, I will take any qualified pilot on my jumpseat.
Shame SAPA has chosen to pit us against each other-I guess I'll have to make it a briefing item.
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
10-14-2019, 11:45 AM
#674
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 38
I get why the United pilot group feels they should have “super priority”. It’s very unfortunate that apparently you’re JS Committe decided to unilaterally change the established JS agreement. The whole thing is very unfortunate and both sides screwed this up!
10-14-2019, 11:55 AM
#675
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 491
Every FOM that I have ever been read had a statement to the effect of any CASS approved pilot at the end of the list. These guys are trying to create a case where one does not exist. Let them beat their chest. At the end of the day there is no FOM violation for taking any CASS pilot. If the jumpseater is in CASS, it is purely up to the captain, and if they want to say no, it is all on them.
10-14-2019, 12:31 PM
#676
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 47
The software change was to happen on the 15th...oops, already started!
10-14-2019, 12:31 PM
#677
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 200
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
10-14-2019, 12:35 PM
#678
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 47
I would suggest your MEC cool the career threats. That's a sure way to have this get ugly. Deny jumpseats in retaliation all you want, in the end United pilots have the upper hand, but threatening someone's career to extort compliance is utterly classless and unbecoming of the professional pilots at United.
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
10-14-2019, 12:43 PM
#679
Line Holder
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 61
I think you’re saying they would take away non-rev benefits? That’s very doubtful since those are negotiated with the CPA. Also they charge the employees for those benefits. But yeah I’m sure the MEC has the backing of UA management.
I get why the United pilot group feels they should have “super priority”. It’s very unfortunate that apparently you’re JS Committe decided to unilaterally change the established JS agreement. The whole thing is very unfortunate and both sides screwed this up!
I get why the United pilot group feels they should have “super priority”. It’s very unfortunate that apparently you’re JS Committe decided to unilaterally change the established JS agreement. The whole thing is very unfortunate and both sides screwed this up!
Again this pilot group, with the backing of MGMT as a result of this being industry standard, is so together on this issue. It doesn’t bode well for the 3 UAX carriers. United will not simply revert back to the way it was. Those days have passed.
When you own ALL your planes, own all your routes and own all the seats in the back of said plane, then and only then will you have leverage. I was at “express” for a LOOOOONG time. And unfortunately we had no leverage then and you sure as hell don’t have any now. Unfortunate but factual truth.
10-14-2019, 12:43 PM
#680
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 47
This thread is impressive, 65+ pages in just a few days.
In all seriousness, I don't see any way that the SKW and RH pilot groups walk away from this with anything resembling a "win". Besides denying jumpseats to a modest percentage of UAL and perhaps even UAX commuters, what else can they really do? Carpet bomb the forums with specious threats and insults I guess. Anything else?
Lots of options still available to the UA pilot group, and we can employ them from the high ground which we will continue to occupy. Our war chest hasn't been tapped in decades and is much, much bigger than that of SKW and RH combined. I wonder if the SKW and RH ringleaders/lifers have considered that DAL is a brother ALPA carrier? I imagine the APA and SWAPA would also lend us a hand if this drags out.
I flew with a CA yesterday who has often commuted on SKW over the years and knows firsthand this fight will affect him if it drags on. He said this reckoning was a "long time coming" and "overdue". He was also well connected with our MEC and didn't seem the least bit concerned about how this would ultimately end. He said our coming response would ultimately be overwhelming. I hope it doesn't come to that but won't feel bad if it does.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled mudslinging...
In all seriousness, I don't see any way that the SKW and RH pilot groups walk away from this with anything resembling a "win". Besides denying jumpseats to a modest percentage of UAL and perhaps even UAX commuters, what else can they really do? Carpet bomb the forums with specious threats and insults I guess. Anything else?
Lots of options still available to the UA pilot group, and we can employ them from the high ground which we will continue to occupy. Our war chest hasn't been tapped in decades and is much, much bigger than that of SKW and RH combined. I wonder if the SKW and RH ringleaders/lifers have considered that DAL is a brother ALPA carrier? I imagine the APA and SWAPA would also lend us a hand if this drags out.
I flew with a CA yesterday who has often commuted on SKW over the years and knows firsthand this fight will affect him if it drags on. He said this reckoning was a "long time coming" and "overdue". He was also well connected with our MEC and didn't seem the least bit concerned about how this would ultimately end. He said our coming response would ultimately be overwhelming. I hope it doesn't come to that but won't feel bad if it does.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled mudslinging...
I will do everything to get a united pilot home or to work. I would ask someone other than a UAL pilot to sit up front and you take that seat in the back. Hell I will still make sure you get a first class seat if it’s open but I am all for reciprocal agreements.
You want back in the Jumpseat? Then list as off line and when I take a 6 month Endeavor guy over you don’t cry about it. That’s reciprocal.
You know what’s right. Make it right. And if you guys want to say the FOM says or doesn’t say...stay tuned.
Last edited by tomgoodman; 10-14-2019 at 03:32 PM. Reason: Deleted epithet
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