Let the Bump Games Begin 19-11D

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08-29-2019, 05:25 PM

#41

Chuck D

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Joined APC: Apr 2010

Posts: 695

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bhramafear

The contract does not always follow pure seniority. I never said it wasn’t allowed by contract. Just that from a pure seniority standpoint it doesn’t pass the sniff test.

that's the conundrum we're always in w/ "pure seniority"... much bigger subject, but "pure seniority" would allow the #1 pilot to grab his/her full stretch of all vacation weeks back to back, the the #2 guy, etc, etc... Man I have no qualms whatsoever w/ seniority but the idea of anything that affects "pure seniority" being bad is I think a bad concept.

08-29-2019, 07:43 PM

#42

Thor

You look like a nail

Joined APC: May 2012

Posts: 451

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bhramafear

The contract does not always follow pure seniority.

I think I know the contract pretty well but can’t think of any examples of how the contract abrogates seniority? Care to share a few examples?

A base trade certainly isn’t one of them.

08-29-2019, 09:22 PM

#43

Thor

You look like a nail

Joined APC: May 2012

Posts: 451

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck D

I think it’s more of a loophole issue - I.e. could not have held ORD except via “backdoor” EWR bid and luck/timing w/ the trade. Can be annoying for more Sr ORD FOs who would have loved that same spot but on the whole I think it’s better to have base trading than kill it.

Agreed, this is an example of anomaly rather than the rule. It's hard for many to imagine stagnation, no bids, and shrinking ASMs even though industry history suggests it'll happen again. When that day comes (not if), it'll be good to have base trades.

08-30-2019, 05:54 AM

#44

Duckdude

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Joined APC: Aug 2010

Position: N/A

Posts: 607

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck D

The number 1 pilot can take all their vacation in a row, if desired. But only two blocks of vacation total in the primary award.

08-30-2019, 08:39 AM

#45

Bhramafear

Line Holder

Joined APC: Aug 2016

Posts: 41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor

I think I know the contract pretty well but can’t think of any examples of how the contract abrogates seniority? Care to share a few examples?

A base trade certainly isn’t one of them.

Base trade and PBS....

08-30-2019, 09:13 AM

#46

O2pilot

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Joined APC: Apr 2015

Posts: 491

Quote:

Originally Posted by webecheck

It would appear many senior FOs don’t want to be separated from their HKG girlfriends...hence the move to SFO where there will soon be twice daily HKG flights.

3rd snapshot has even more volunteers to SFO 777, both FO and Cap. Amazing how many guys will commute from ORD to SFO just to keep flying the HKG trips because wife #2 is there. I wonder how they will rationalize this commute to wife #1?

08-30-2019, 09:15 AM

#47

Master of FiFi

Line Holder

Joined APC: Jan 2016

Posts: 72

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor

I think I know the contract pretty well but can’t think of any examples of how the contract abrogates seniority? Care to share a few examples?

A base trade certainly isn’t one of them.

There is also a situation with seniority trip trading. Say you try to swap to an open trip and a pilot junior to you also wants it. If a pilot senior to you wants the trip the pilot junior to you is trying to drop, it will give him the junior pilot's trip and give the pilot junior to you the open time trip to repair his schedule.

PDRed and legal, and it said that a lot of trip trading happens this way.

08-30-2019, 09:19 AM

#48

O2pilot

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Joined APC: Apr 2015

Posts: 491

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master of FiFi

I had this happen once. Primo trip opened up and I wanted it, but saw a guy senior to me also wanted it. After I got it I looked and found out that the only reason I got it awarded was because my trip didn’t go into open time, but was wanted by a guy who was in the top 10% in base, so the only way he could get my trip was if I got the open trip, because I didn’t have a drop in, but a 1-for-1 trade.

08-30-2019, 10:19 AM

#49

webecheck

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Joined APC: Dec 2007

Posts: 666

Quote:

Originally Posted by O2pilot

It is incredible. And if they actually live at ord and don’t commute there, someone should tell them they aren’t wife #2s only husband...perhaps they already know that.

08-30-2019, 10:58 AM

#50

mmm123

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Joined APC: Jan 2019

Posts: 177

Quote:

Originally Posted by O2pilot

Sure whatever you like to think but the truth is the way this is going down just takes away more cash from this company that we should be negotiating for right now.