Spirit of NKS
01-22-2015, 08:37 PM
#9882
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: Airbus
Posts: 213
This only applies to building lines, not training or transition. A perfect example is a few months ago I had a 4 day where 3 of the days were carry in, the next month I had a 4 day that started on the 6th, thus 2 days off between sequences. They had to drop the 4 day due to a 29/7 issue, however much it sucked they then put me back on RF days for the entire 4 days dropped. No 4 days off between sequences. Furthermore because NLV= OLV-TD+CI+TA I got hosed even further. The three days at the beginning and end of the month aka transition where the 4 day off rule does not apply has to do with having 1,2,or 3 days off built at the end of every month, otherwise if the language was not there every month would have to begin and end with 4 days off or a trip.
01-22-2015, 09:25 PM
#9883
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,577
For those of you who are curious about the 4 day/ 5 to maximum extent possible, it applies to the original lines built by the company and union. It has nothing to do with training or with transition. Section 25 subsection B(Monthly Bid Package Preperation) g(Regular lines that shall contain).5) "To the maximum extent possible, blocks of five consecutive days off in domicile. In lieu of the above, to the maximum extent possible, no less than four consecutive days off in domicile, except regular lines may contain blocks of less than four consecutive days off in domicile on the first three and last three days of the month. Exceptions to multiple day-off blocks may occur with prior consultation of the Scheduling Committee chairman."
This only applies to building lines, not training or transition. A perfect example is a few months ago I had a 4 day where 3 of the days were carry in, the next month I had a 4 day that started on the 6th, thus 2 days off between sequences. They had to drop the 4 day due to a 29/7 issue, however much it sucked they then put me back on RF days for the entire 4 days dropped. No 4 days off between sequences. Furthermore because NLV= OLV-TD+CI+TA I got hosed even further. The three days at the beginning and end of the month aka transition where the 4 day off rule does not apply has to do with having 1,2,or 3 days off built at the end of every month, otherwise if the language was not there every month would have to begin and end with 4 days off or a trip.
This only applies to building lines, not training or transition. A perfect example is a few months ago I had a 4 day where 3 of the days were carry in, the next month I had a 4 day that started on the 6th, thus 2 days off between sequences. They had to drop the 4 day due to a 29/7 issue, however much it sucked they then put me back on RF days for the entire 4 days dropped. No 4 days off between sequences. Furthermore because NLV= OLV-TD+CI+TA I got hosed even further. The three days at the beginning and end of the month aka transition where the 4 day off rule does not apply has to do with having 1,2,or 3 days off built at the end of every month, otherwise if the language was not there every month would have to begin and end with 4 days off or a trip.
01-22-2015, 11:05 PM
#9884
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2012
Posts: 173
Wow, I'm going to have to spend a few hours with that equation, you lost me shortly after the CBA quote. I have no idea what an "RF day" is. You may have found yourself attached to another object by an inclined plane wrapped helically about an axis. All that being said, can someone tell me where the exemption for training is regarding the 5 days off?
01-22-2015, 11:22 PM
#9885
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2015
Posts: 57
That's my question as well. To me, this LOA isn't about IPads or distance learning. It's about productivity. We are agreeing to fly more days and do training during our personal time. The company can make us do this training in domicile or wherever, but the bottom line is that they want those extra days for productive flying not training. They can only get this with a yes vote. Are we getting fair value for selling them this productivity?
As an aside, who cares about 'industry leading distance learning'? Where did that rank in the contract survey? I bet it wasn't mentioned by anyone. I support our MEC. I am, however, concerned about the pro-LOA arguments I'm hearing. If this is how negotiations are heading, maybe it's time to update the Delta app.
As an aside, who cares about 'industry leading distance learning'? Where did that rank in the contract survey? I bet it wasn't mentioned by anyone. I support our MEC. I am, however, concerned about the pro-LOA arguments I'm hearing. If this is how negotiations are heading, maybe it's time to update the Delta app.
Saying no doesn't mean they will not offer another better offer but yes sure does.
01-23-2015, 05:04 AM
#9886
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Switch, Lever & Light Specialist
Posts: 1,065
12 or 13 day off lines?! I hope they don't start pulling that crap in Vegas. This is something that needs to be addressed in our next contract. Min days off for all line holders should be 15 and we need a much higher daily min. That should fix that problem. 12 day off lines.. That's awful.
01-23-2015, 07:07 AM
#9887
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Position: A320 Left
Posts: 715
From everything I'm hearing, the status quo regarding training is changing. The majority of us will be taking a pay cut because of it. The LOA may gain us back an hour or two of that pay possibly, at the expense of doing training in our off time. I've reached a decision to vote No. Management can force this pay cut upon us, but I'm not going to agree to it myself. Maybe that's ignorant in some people's mind, but oh well. To those that thought this LOA was magnanimous on management's part need only to see it was merely an iron fist in a velvet glove. Let them spend the money on infrastructure to accommodate all of us coming to base to do ground. Let them continue to schedule days of training at the expense of revenue producing flying. Or let them give us a better deal. I won't vote in my own pay cut, sorry.
01-23-2015, 07:44 AM
#9888
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,466
From everything I'm hearing, the status quo regarding training is changing. The majority of us will be taking a pay cut because of it. The LOA may gain us back an hour or two of that pay possibly, at the expense of doing training in our off time. I've reached a decision to vote No. Management can force this pay cut upon us, but I'm not going to agree to it myself. Maybe that's ignorant in some people's mind, but oh well. To those that thought this LOA was magnanimous on management's part need only to see it was merely an iron fist in a velvet glove. Let them spend the money on infrastructure to accommodate all of us coming to base to do ground. Let them continue to schedule days of training at the expense of revenue producing flying. Or let them give us a better deal. I won't vote in my own pay cut, sorry.
I hope I'm wrong but I fear it will be voted in. I have heard a few to many with the "its better than my last (insert airline here).
People this is not your last airline, it's your career. You're a professional, you have fought hard to get here, you should be treated and paid appropriately.
Never settle for less.
01-23-2015, 07:53 AM
#9889
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,857
From everything I'm hearing, the status quo regarding training is changing. The majority of us will be taking a pay cut because of it. The LOA may gain us back an hour or two of that pay possibly, at the expense of doing training in our off time. I've reached a decision to vote No. Management can force this pay cut upon us, but I'm not going to agree to it myself. Maybe that's ignorant in some people's mind, but oh well. To those that thought this LOA was magnanimous on management's part need only to see it was merely an iron fist in a velvet glove. Let them spend the money on infrastructure to accommodate all of us coming to base to do ground. Let them continue to schedule days of training at the expense of revenue producing flying. Or let them give us a better deal. I won't vote in my own pay cut, sorry.
Agreed, fair is fair, 18 hrs of pay for 18 hrs gnd school in my own personal time, I'm still a NO. This I-pad deal should have been given to us as for what it is, another work tool, no LOA, no strings attached, just something to replace the multimillion dollar expense in paper they have.....Now the Online training should be a totally different proposal.
01-23-2015, 07:57 AM
#9890
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,857
I like this!
I hope I'm wrong but I fear it will be voted in. I have heard a few to many with the "its better than my last (insert airline here).
People this is not your last airline, it's your career. You're a professional, you have fought hard to get here, you should be treated and paid appropriately.
Never settle for less.
I hope I'm wrong but I fear it will be voted in. I have heard a few to many with the "its better than my last (insert airline here).
People this is not your last airline, it's your career. You're a professional, you have fought hard to get here, you should be treated and paid appropriately.
Never settle for less.
Man that's is so f-ing annoying, or Ipads are cool....
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