Lobaeux

I did the same thing, right out of the ATP question bank.

MikeF16

I see a lot of Spirit pilots talk about how you've got good work rules. As a mil guy I really don't know what constitutes good vs. bad when it comes to part 121 work rules. Can anybody give examples (maybe even compare to either UAL or JB) that show how Spirit has good work rules? Thanks!

JoeyMeatballs

I don't know much about JetBlue or UALs work rules but here are a few of my favorites.

--hard minimum of 4 days off between pairings

--Line bidding (allows for conflicts which we are pay protected for)

-- days can not be rolled (means on day 4 they can't call you and make you go somewhere for a 5th night.

--reserve work rules are better then most airlines. It's a bit complicated and too many examples to list

-- junior man pay is 200%(Scheduling calls you and asks you if you would like to fly a trip they need covered) I'd prefer 150% open time pick up to be honest.

--small detail but if you're stuck working a holiday you get paid $75 extra

--my personal favorite. On your last day of reserve you are automatically released 6hrs prior to the end of your call out

-- whatever trip you get assigned while on reserve, it has to get you back no later than 4 hrs past the end of your call out time.

--get paid an extra day if you get in past 2am

Lobaeux

Here's one for the mil guys that shocked me!

On reserve (like being on Bravo, you have a three hour call out), they can't call you up one hour before your reserve period ends and have you go fly a 16 hour day. Your reserve pairing may be for four days, but you only sit for one day at a time (unless you get called in, then it's just a regular trip), so say your reserve period for that day ends at 1700, you're not going to get a call at 1600 to go fly a trip that day. Plus, like Joey says, you're auto-released 6 hours prior to the end of your final reserve day.
I'm sure it's like this at other airlines, but this one was a huge difference between mil vs. 121.

Qotsaautopilot

I don't think that's entirely accurate. Your call time is a call time so they can call you at 1600 even if your call time ends at 1700 if they can fit you into the legal duty limits.

Example: you have been on a trip that gets done at 2300 your reserve day on the next day is scheduled at 0300-1700. Because you need domicile rest you can't go on call until 1000 making your new call time 1000-1700. They can call you at 1659 and give you a 1959 push for anything that would keep you within the scheduled duty limits. I want to say its 14hrs.

stage5

continuing the reserve questions - is there some reserve gouge or other ALPA intro material? (besides the actual contract) .or mainly tribal knowledge of how reserve rules work in practice?

I looked through the ALPA-SPA website but didn't have much success.
maybe I missed it but is there an nks internal forum? (or is APC the official one? )

thanks!

Excel

It is accurate if you haven't been assigned a trip. Say you have 8am-10pm reserve. They can't call and assign you a trip that goes over 14hrs. (They can assign you a trip that would originally end by 10pm but because delay etc... Push it to 16hrs, but the original assignment has to end within 14hrs ie 10pm). What this means is, in this example, at 7pm you are useless to fly a trip. We have 3hrs to push the plane from the time you are notified. So you are useless. Our shortest trip in the system is about 1 hour block, plus you get 30 minutes after blocking in counted as part of your duty time, so it is more realistic that you are finished after 5:30 or 9.5 hours.

Now if you call after 530pm or so and ask to be released, they might not do so only as it prohibits the schedulers from assigning a trip to you until you start reserve the following day. IE they would have to wait until 10:01am to call you and you would have until 1:01pm to push off the gate. If you are not released they can still call you at 959pm for a 10am departure and that is completely legal.

Clear as mud? Doesn't help that I'm typing on a dumb phone.

Qotsaautopilot

Yes sir. Great info. I just wanted to make sure the poster knew that there were times when you could be used in his example. Maybe he already knew that.

Lobaeux

Yeah, I was typing on a phone as well. The special instance you mentioned hasn't happened yet to me, but I understand that can happen.

What happens in the military was being on reserve (Alpha, Bravo or Charlie Alert, differences being the call out time), and you could be 1 minute before the end of your reserve period, they could call you in to fly a 16, or 18 hour day (if augmented) without batting an eye. And, say your reserve period was three days long, you could be sent out on a trip that lasts over a week. That doesn't happen here.

What's also nice, and I'm sure it doesn't always happen, but I've been given ample time before I've been called off of reserve to go fly, it's not been a surprise call, "rush to the airport" yet.

MikeF16

Fighters don't use reserve so this is all really new to me. I've sat alert, but that was a live in gov't quarters 100 meters from the jets and when the klaxon goes off be in the air in 5/10/15 minutes (depending on alert level).

Does Spirit also have a long call? A friend of mine who is very junior at another airline and only just finished ioe was sitting long call from his home a good 4-5 hour flight away from his domicile. I thought that was a pretty good deal .