Spirit of NKS
#5782
After DOS+4 is there an annual increase while the parties are in section 6 negotiations? Or is it just the longevity step?
Thanks
Thanks
#5783
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Left
Posts: 192
Just the longevity bumps on your DOH, no COLA or any other built-in bumps on DOS or any other time. A little short sighted should management decide to drag their feet for 3 years like during the last negotiations.
#5784
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: 320 Left soon middle
Posts: 488
Lots of guys think this time around management will come to the table sooner to get rid of the transition language and line bidding. The two together is estimated to account for some 15-20% pilot staffing.
I personally think they might come out with a low ball offer but only if that will save them money. I.e. give us an instant 10% raise and go pref bid. That would save them some money but I doubt anyone here will go for that. I won't. 15% cut in staffing means stagnation for at least 1-2 years or longer while we are still getting airplanes. Eff that!
They would have to give us a larger raise like 25-30% for this to be even considered by the pilot group. I would still vote no, but I think most guys would go for that. But the company will never give 25%. That does not save them money. So they will just drag their feet like last time. So my guess is, we won't see a contract for a while.
I personally think they might come out with a low ball offer but only if that will save them money. I.e. give us an instant 10% raise and go pref bid. That would save them some money but I doubt anyone here will go for that. I won't. 15% cut in staffing means stagnation for at least 1-2 years or longer while we are still getting airplanes. Eff that!
They would have to give us a larger raise like 25-30% for this to be even considered by the pilot group. I would still vote no, but I think most guys would go for that. But the company will never give 25%. That does not save them money. So they will just drag their feet like last time. So my guess is, we won't see a contract for a while.
#5785
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: CA
Posts: 1,226
Lots of guys think this time around management will come to the table sooner to get rid of the transition language and line bidding. The two together is estimated to account for some 15-20% pilot staffing.
I personally think they might come out with a low ball offer but only if that will save them money. I.e. give us an instant 10% raise and go pref bid. That would save them some money but I doubt anyone here will go for that. I won't. 15% cut in staffing means stagnation for at least 1-2 years or longer while we are still getting airplanes. Eff that!
They would have to give us a larger raise like 25-30% for this to be even considered by the pilot group. I would still vote no, but I think most guys would go for that. But the company will never give 25%. That does not save them money. So they will just drag their feet like last time. So my guess is, we won't see a contract for a while.
I personally think they might come out with a low ball offer but only if that will save them money. I.e. give us an instant 10% raise and go pref bid. That would save them some money but I doubt anyone here will go for that. I won't. 15% cut in staffing means stagnation for at least 1-2 years or longer while we are still getting airplanes. Eff that!
They would have to give us a larger raise like 25-30% for this to be even considered by the pilot group. I would still vote no, but I think most guys would go for that. But the company will never give 25%. That does not save them money. So they will just drag their feet like last time. So my guess is, we won't see a contract for a while.
#5786
I'll vote for anything, as long as the company has to buy me one of those big third world dictator hats. Comes in handy at my side job as a skycap.
#5787
Yeah, it is . . . sadly. I hope that our group can see the career-long implications of going to a pref-bid system.
While anything is on the table, we need to be getting something truly industry leading for giving concessions at a profitable carrier with below industry average hourly rates. A 25% raise alone - that doesn't even equal what Delta was paying 13 years ago!
Those are just some areas that we need to look at improving upon before we even begin to talk concessions like PBS. And we need hats, of course.
PBS is a concession.
While anything is on the table, we need to be getting something truly industry leading for giving concessions at a profitable carrier with below industry average hourly rates. A 25% raise alone - that doesn't even equal what Delta was paying 13 years ago!
- 19.4% B Plan or 'no match 401k' (Hawaiian)
- 5.5 min day, not averaged (Southwest)
- .61/hour duty rig (Southwest)
- min 15 days off/month (Southwest)
- International pay for any destination outside CONUS($6.50 for CA's, $4.50 for FO's - Delta, United)
- 5 days off between pairings (we already are supposed to have this!)
- Downtown layover if longer than 12 hours (Delta)
- Global Entry reimbursement (United)
- 6 months furlough pay (Delta)
- 50% override for DH in middle seat (United)
Those are just some areas that we need to look at improving upon before we even begin to talk concessions like PBS. And we need hats, of course.
PBS is a concession.
#5788
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,857
Yeah, it is . . . sadly. I hope that our group can see the career-long implications of going to a pref-bid system.
While anything is on the table, we need to be getting something truly industry leading for giving concessions at a profitable carrier with below industry average hourly rates. A 25% raise alone - that doesn't even equal what Delta was paying 13 years ago!
Those are just some areas that we need to look at improving upon before we even begin to talk concessions like PBS. And we need hats, of course.
PBS is a concession.
While anything is on the table, we need to be getting something truly industry leading for giving concessions at a profitable carrier with below industry average hourly rates. A 25% raise alone - that doesn't even equal what Delta was paying 13 years ago!
- 19.4% B Plan or 'no match 401k' (Hawaiian)
- 5.5 min day, not averaged (Southwest)
- .61/hour duty rig (Southwest)
- min 15 days off/month (Southwest)
- International pay for any destination outside CONUS($6.50 for CA's, $4.50 for FO's - Delta, United)
- 5 days off between pairings (we already are supposed to have this!)
- Downtown layover if longer than 12 hours (Delta)
- Global Entry reimbursement (United)
- 6 months furlough pay (Delta)
- 50% override for DH in middle seat (United)
Those are just some areas that we need to look at improving upon before we even begin to talk concessions like PBS. And we need hats, of course.
PBS is a concession.
Agreed with all, but why are you mad?, we haven't even starting to get a team ready to negotiate the next commandments. I think we should start gathering some data, opinion and show a strong commitment to a not better but leading contract.
Look, I really doubt anyone prior to June 2010 really wants pbs. I think we all hate the idea, at any cost. Loosing premium pay it's an example. Even a good number of us YES voters were upset about it. But you pick up and keep going.
We all want more efficiency, (higher line cdt) vs this 72-76 avrg cr9p we are seeing, and 5 days off. PBS isn't one of the things nor should even be part of our negotiations. After 5.5 years, I'm yet to hear a Spirit pilot wanting PBS.
And if a new hire, after contract 2010 even entertains the idea, it needs to be questioned why, then lead pipe (jk), NK style.
But getting mad about it isn't gonna help us at all. We all pull together, learn from the last negotiations and make it even better.
Getting a team together, asking our reps "how are we getting rdy for this next contract" and getting involve it's the most important thing. Two reasons, we want them (neg committee) to know that they have our support and with our participation there is little room for unwanted decisions or surprises.
All together. It's easy to seat on the sidelines, and wait for a great contract or bad and then point fingers (4 point back).
But I agree with you 100%, and Ram hat idea (I want a pineapple with Xmas lights on mine).
Cheers
#5789
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Airplane
Posts: 2,385
Can I get a Fez? Or better yet a sweet-looking Viking helmet? I've been watching my recorded episodes of "Vikings", I feel like raiding something!
#5790
Banned
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: A-320
Posts: 6,929
Agreed with all, but why are you mad?, we haven't even starting to get a team ready to negotiate the next commandments. I think we should start gathering some data, opinion and show a strong commitment to a not better but leading contract.
Look, I really doubt anyone prior to June 2010 really wants pbs. I think we all hate the idea, at any cost. Loosing premium pay it's an example. Even a good number of us YES voters were upset about it. But you pick up and keep going.
We all want more efficiency, (higher line cdt) vs this 72-76 avrg cr9p we are seeing, and 5 days off. PBS isn't one of the things nor should even be part of our negotiations. After 5.5 years, I'm yet to hear a Spirit pilot wanting PBS.
And if a new hire, after contract 2010 even entertains the idea, it needs to be questioned why, then lead pipe (jk), NK style.
But getting mad about it isn't gonna help us at all. We all pull together, learn from the last negotiations and make it even better.
Getting a team together, asking our reps "how are we getting rdy for this next contract" and getting involve it's the most important thing. Two reasons, we want them (neg committee) to know that they have our support and with our participation there is little room for unwanted decisions or surprises.
All together. It's easy to seat on the sidelines, and wait for a great contract or bad and then point fingers (4 point back).
But I agree with you 100%, and Ram hat idea (I want a pineapple with Xmas lights on mine).
Cheers
Look, I really doubt anyone prior to June 2010 really wants pbs. I think we all hate the idea, at any cost. Loosing premium pay it's an example. Even a good number of us YES voters were upset about it. But you pick up and keep going.
We all want more efficiency, (higher line cdt) vs this 72-76 avrg cr9p we are seeing, and 5 days off. PBS isn't one of the things nor should even be part of our negotiations. After 5.5 years, I'm yet to hear a Spirit pilot wanting PBS.
And if a new hire, after contract 2010 even entertains the idea, it needs to be questioned why, then lead pipe (jk), NK style.
But getting mad about it isn't gonna help us at all. We all pull together, learn from the last negotiations and make it even better.
Getting a team together, asking our reps "how are we getting rdy for this next contract" and getting involve it's the most important thing. Two reasons, we want them (neg committee) to know that they have our support and with our participation there is little room for unwanted decisions or surprises.
All together. It's easy to seat on the sidelines, and wait for a great contract or bad and then point fingers (4 point back).
But I agree with you 100%, and Ram hat idea (I want a pineapple with Xmas lights on mine).
Cheers
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