Originally Posted by Halon1211

I’m going to suggest you have no rebuttal for the points that the “Used car salesman” said at the roadshow?

Originally Posted by Lakeaffect

It’s not like it’s a full CBA with complex issues. For the majority of us non-training pilots we got pay, retirement, night overide, leg to leg, and uniforms. Do you need an “expert” to explain those to you? The roadshow “experts” will use fear tactics or whatever works to sell you on those issues/gains. They have nothing to gain by saying: “yea, well maybe we could get more”

Originally Posted by otter1

I went to the DTW roadshow. I recommend that everyone go to a roadshow or I believe they will have a streamed one as well. They explain how we got to this point and why they believe this is the best we can get for the short term. They have the ALPA lawyer there, as well as the financial analyst. A lot of your questions and complaints will be answered by the presentation. They also explain why if we do turn this down, we could possibly go into the TPA and the SLI with C2018, which could negatively impact the "career expectations" part of the SLI argument for our side. The ALPA lawyer conveyed that timing really isn't on our side if we turn this down.

Reserve drops was one of my biggest disappointments as well as many on this board (I'm on reserve right now), but they explained why we didn't get that as well. It was I believe the only goal not achieved in this TA.

One of the goals for the TPA is "economic symmetry" with Jetblue.

Everyone has to do what they think is best, and this isn't what a lot of us were hoping for, but I do trust the negotiating team and the pay gains are significant.

Again, go to a roadshow and make an informed decision.

Originally Posted by AllOva736

Question : why would the union who is made up of seniority list pilots not gain from us getting more? And why do they want us to sign a bum deal? How do they benefit from us just “ getting something “ when they’re paid the same rates that the rest of the group will be. I honestly don’t understand how the union wins if we just sign something. All APC BS aside, how is it a win for them as if they’re on the BOD or something?

Originally Posted by symbian simian

About 400 times.
And if our only leverage is first year pay something went wrong.
And I would be more likely to vote yes for the TA if first year pay & training pay had been decent, because it would be the right thing for the new guys.
So I am all for the company raising it.
It would send the signal that there's more money they are willing to give us.
Better to vote no, and all off us get something better, but stop crying about first year pay.

Originally Posted by fumeevented

what dont you autolanders understand about this? The company wants to be able to raise first year pay without our say. Why do they want that?

The whole purpose of the clause is to make the pay scale seem reasonable in relation to first year at $90. How insulting would it look if the TA had 1st year at $137 with everything else the same? Because that is exactly what they will do.

Not to mention the baggage we will bring with us to the merger. B6 management isnt going to be so quick to get rid of that item in the JCBA.

Originally Posted by CincoDeMayo

I always love it when you “derail”. What is an “auto lander?”

imagine how much your head would explode if JBLU had the same first year provision in their TA 🤯

Remember when you were yelling at me, how stupid I was because I didn’t realize that the displacement bid was F9 driven and would go away after the merger fell through. Haha. How well did that age?

Keep being you. I’ll hang up and listen

Originally Posted by AllOva736

Question : why would the union who is made up of seniority list pilots not gain from us getting more? And why do they want us to sign a bum deal? How do they benefit from us just “ getting something “ when they’re paid the same rates that the rest of the group will be. I honestly don’t understand how the union wins if we just sign something. All APC BS aside, how is it a win for them as if they’re on the BOD or something?

Originally Posted by AllOva736

Question : why would the union who is made up of seniority list pilots not gain from us getting more? And why do they want us to sign a bum deal? How do they benefit from us just “ getting something “ when they’re paid the same rates that the rest of the group will be. I honestly don’t understand how the union wins if we just sign something. All APC BS aside, how is it a win for them as if they’re on the BOD or something?