TA Reached
#361
That/It/Thang
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,954
So many special cases here.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
#362
Line Holder
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 91
See above.
I don’t understand this fetish many senior people have about wanting to screw over the newbies. I mean everybody talks about wanting legacy rates - I want that too - but the legacies don’t screw over their newbies (OK, Hawaii excepted).
I’m beginning to suspect it’s some kind of a cult sexual fetish…
I don’t understand this fetish many senior people have about wanting to screw over the newbies. I mean everybody talks about wanting legacy rates - I want that too - but the legacies don’t screw over their newbies (OK, Hawaii excepted).
I’m beginning to suspect it’s some kind of a cult sexual fetish…
#364
Line Holder
Joined APC: Nov 2019
Posts: 76
See above.
I don’t understand this fetish many senior people have about wanting to screw over the newbies. I mean everybody talks about wanting legacy rates - I want that too - but the legacies don’t screw over their newbies (OK, Hawaii excepted).
I’m beginning to suspect it’s some kind of a cult sexual fetish…
I don’t understand this fetish many senior people have about wanting to screw over the newbies. I mean everybody talks about wanting legacy rates - I want that too - but the legacies don’t screw over their newbies (OK, Hawaii excepted).
I’m beginning to suspect it’s some kind of a cult sexual fetish…
UPS, I don't believe, ever had an issue with FO's leaving after 9 months because first year was $29. They were committed to being in for the long haul and enjoying the 12 year rate for every year. Kids these days want it all up front for one year and then have a diluted next 25. The times we live in.
Edit.....what TX said above.
#365
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2021
Posts: 1,035
I say we send it back and have them come back with something better which I suspect would be within a month of the no vote.
The entire industry changed while this was being negotiated. United had a mutiny, AA sent back an AIP that never even went to a vote and was higher than this, Alaska signed a deal with legacy parity snap up. Delta has an AIP that blows everyone away. JetBlue on the cusp of a deal that will blow us away I suspect. Southwest is a wild card. Frontier won’t have a contract for years bc the company raised first year on its own, added bonuses and is implementing cadet programs modeled after their other portfolio airlines.
Things change and so should our expectations. This isn’t going to be some long drawn out process like usual. Spirit needs this so much more than we do or they wouldn’t offer anything. They are just trying to see what they can get away with.
The entire industry changed while this was being negotiated. United had a mutiny, AA sent back an AIP that never even went to a vote and was higher than this, Alaska signed a deal with legacy parity snap up. Delta has an AIP that blows everyone away. JetBlue on the cusp of a deal that will blow us away I suspect. Southwest is a wild card. Frontier won’t have a contract for years bc the company raised first year on its own, added bonuses and is implementing cadet programs modeled after their other portfolio airlines.
Things change and so should our expectations. This isn’t going to be some long drawn out process like usual. Spirit needs this so much more than we do or they wouldn’t offer anything. They are just trying to see what they can get away with.
#366
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2015
Posts: 394
So many special cases here.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
Give spirit the ability to slide 1st year pay, but make it slide everyone else too.
#367
So many special cases here.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
What do you really want? Pay them $95? Pay them $137? Or simply pay them $95, but not allow the company to slide with the hope that will bring them back to the table for more money? Why? At that point it’s cheaper to offer ponies to new hire pilots outside of comp.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
What do you really want? Pay them $95? Pay them $137? Or simply pay them $95, but not allow the company to slide with the hope that will bring them back to the table for more money? Why? At that point it’s cheaper to offer ponies to new hire pilots outside of comp.
#368
That/It/Thang
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,954
Haha. You said “laber,” after responding to a post where you said “payed,” while trying to distinguish yourself as superior to “discounted laber”
#369
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 417
So many special cases here.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
#370
Line Holder
Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 91
So many special cases here.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
$95/hr first year, people on here saying “that won’t help attrition, they are screwed”
So the company has the ability to raise first year to $137/hr, and people are flipping out, calling it a “concession”
But… if the company negotiated $137 flat for first year pay during these talks, people would be saying “ok, that might help attrition,” and suddenly it’s not a concession but a gain for first year pilots.
Most of you just get lost in your own logic.
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