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Old 12-11-2022, 03:08 PM
  #341  
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Originally Posted by Chimpy
fair enough, wasn’t trying to poke fun…
No worries I was just lying I'm actually just slightly dumb, one too many drops when I was a kido you know.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:10 PM
  #342  
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Originally Posted by Tx Paratroopr
No worries I was just lying I'm actually just slightly dumb, one too many drops when I was a kido you know.
If we were smart we wouldn’t be flying planes for a living, lol.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:11 PM
  #343  
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Originally Posted by Chimpy
the term you’re looking for is “leverage” and I agree, I don’t know why the NC agreed to that, but a Concession in this case, would be giving up Red/green or something like that.
No, concession works just fine. We’ve “conceded” control of first year pay to the company. End of story.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:12 PM
  #344  
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Originally Posted by CincoDeMayo
If the merger fails, we open section 6 back up with Spirit.
True, but what leverage will we have at that point? If first year pay is close to second, and classes are filling, even if we open immediately, it’ll be a marathon with no reason for management to come forward with a good deal. I’m playing this conservatively and assuming all the chips fall against us (no merger, and full classes).

The money in this deal isn’t my biggest concern…..
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:13 PM
  #345  
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Originally Posted by PossibleDeviation
No concession works just fine. We’ve “conceded” control of first year pay to the company. End of story.
No. The TA negotiates parameters for first year pay, just as it does for every other year group.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:17 PM
  #346  
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Originally Posted by Excargodog
No. The TA negotiates parameters for first year pay, just as it does for every other year group.
So if the TA passes, can the company increase first year pay, without negotiation? Yes or no? If yes, how did they get that? Oh, we’ve conceded that to them.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:18 PM
  #347  
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Originally Posted by Tranquility
True, but what leverage will we have at that point? If first year pay is close to second, and classes are filling, even if we open immediately, it’ll be a marathon with no reason for management to come forward with a good deal. I’m playing this conservatively and assuming all the chips fall against us (no merger, and full classes).

The money in this deal isn’t my biggest concern…..
The bulk of the attrition is not coming from first year FOs. And if they lower hiring criteria enough, classes will fill.

You also have to consider that this is only a two year deal. They could have gone with a longer and nominally better deal and back loaded it. Then it would have been JBs problem.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:21 PM
  #348  
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Originally Posted by PossibleDeviation
So if the TA passes, can the company increase first year pay, without negotiation? Yes or no? If yes, how did they get that? Oh, we’ve conceded that to them.
Nope. They ALREADY negotiated the ability to do that in THIS TA. Those are the parameters. You don’t have to like it, you can certainly vote no. But that’s what YOUR NC negotiated. Take it or leave it.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:24 PM
  #349  
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Originally Posted by Excargodog
Nope. They ALREADY negotiated the ability to do that in THIS TA. Those are the parameters. You don’t have to like it, you can certainly vote no. But that’s what YOUR NC negotiated. Take it or leave it.
No **** Sherlock. What other TA do you think I’m talking about?! Your reading comprehension needs some work.
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Old 12-11-2022, 03:34 PM
  #350  
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Originally Posted by PossibleDeviation
So if the TA passes, can the company increase first year pay, without negotiation? Yes or no? If yes, how did they get that? Oh, we’ve conceded that to them.
No. We NEGOTIATED it with them. Just as we negotiated every other pay increase. There is a difference

Originally Posted by PossibleDeviation
No **** Sherlock. What other TA do you think I’m talking about?! Your reading comprehension needs some work.
I think it’s YOUR reading comprehension that needs work. The first year pay was negotiated in the same manner as all the other increases, by an AIP and a TA. If you don’t like it, vote against it. By your logic, the entire TA is a concession because you didn’t get what you wanted or because the NC NEGOTIATED away the ability to hold impoverished newbies hostage.
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