Attrition
01-22-2022, 05:12 PM
#581
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,189
WB FO normally goes senior to NB CA. However, a lot of countries essentially lock up flight crews in their hotel rooms for their entire time off. You can only leave the room if you smoke; I've been told that a lot of WB crews have taken up smoking.
Imagine going to Sydney and being locked in your hotel room for 40 hours with a guard outside of it. And your meals left at the door.
Once everything goes back to normal, you won't see WB FO going junior. And while some talk about how bad WB reserve is, I spent a decent amount of time on WB reserve as a commuter. It wasn't bad. I'd still be doing it if it paid as much as NB CA.
Imagine going to Sydney and being locked in your hotel room for 40 hours with a guard outside of it. And your meals left at the door.
Once everything goes back to normal, you won't see WB FO going junior. And while some talk about how bad WB reserve is, I spent a decent amount of time on WB reserve as a commuter. It wasn't bad. I'd still be doing it if it paid as much as NB CA.
No doubt that used to be the case, though.
Theres probably a multitude of reason. I actually like it here, a lot, and don’t plan on leaving, but if I found myself at a legacy, I personally would never bid WB. I almost never do transcons here. The thought of 8-10-12-14 hours in an airplane (whether your “flying” or not) does not sound appealing to me at all. I’m sure im
not alone.
Also it sounds like you are 2 year seat locked on the WB. It’s a flat $80-90 first year regardless of what metal your flying. Sounds like most can be line holders before Year 2 pay on 737/320 75/6 (extreme cases maybe even CA). It’s not a huge surprise it’s junior at the moment.
01-22-2022, 05:39 PM
#582
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: guppy CA
Posts: 5,171
That is over with now. I have a couple friends at Atlas and one Kalita. 2 of the 3 have FB. Their pictures outside exploring Sydney this past month prove otherwise.
No doubt that used to be the case, though.
Theres probably a multitude of reason. I actually like it here, a lot, and don’t plan on leaving, but if I found myself at a legacy, I personally would never bid WB. I almost never do transcons here. The thought of 8-10-12-14 hours in an airplane (whether your “flying” or not) does not sound appealing to me at all. I’m sure im
not alone.
Also it sounds like you are 2 year seat locked on the WB. It’s a flat $80-90 first year regardless of what metal your flying. Sounds like most can be line holders before Year 2 pay on 737/320 75/6 (extreme cases maybe even CA). It’s not a huge surprise it’s junior at the moment.
No doubt that used to be the case, though.
Theres probably a multitude of reason. I actually like it here, a lot, and don’t plan on leaving, but if I found myself at a legacy, I personally would never bid WB. I almost never do transcons here. The thought of 8-10-12-14 hours in an airplane (whether your “flying” or not) does not sound appealing to me at all. I’m sure im
not alone.
Also it sounds like you are 2 year seat locked on the WB. It’s a flat $80-90 first year regardless of what metal your flying. Sounds like most can be line holders before Year 2 pay on 737/320 75/6 (extreme cases maybe even CA). It’s not a huge surprise it’s junior at the moment.
Not to mention that severe lockdown policies can be put in place at any time.
As far as flying WB, I absolutely loved it. Some absolutely hate it once they get on the fleet. It's not for everyone. In normal times, it goes extremely senior.
And I'll add that the JBLU guys used to say, 'I don't want to fly international'. Until they started flying to LHR.
You're not really seat locked on WBs. You can opt to go to NB CA and the seat lock doesn't apply. There is at least one other way to get out of the seat lock, but no need to get that detailed for this discussion.
01-23-2022, 10:41 PM
#583
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,595
OK; I'll take your word for it. I don't keep track of that stuff. Does it apply to SIN, TLV, PVG, PEK, and a number of other international destinations?
Not to mention that severe lockdown policies can be put in place at any time.
As far as flying WB, I absolutely loved it. Some absolutely hate it once they get on the fleet. It's not for everyone. In normal times, it goes extremely senior.
And I'll add that the JBLU guys used to say, 'I don't want to fly international'. Until they started flying to LHR.
You're not really seat locked on WBs. You can opt to go to NB CA and the seat lock doesn't apply. There is at least one other way to get out of the seat lock, but no need to get that detailed for this discussion.
Not to mention that severe lockdown policies can be put in place at any time.
As far as flying WB, I absolutely loved it. Some absolutely hate it once they get on the fleet. It's not for everyone. In normal times, it goes extremely senior.
And I'll add that the JBLU guys used to say, 'I don't want to fly international'. Until they started flying to LHR.
You're not really seat locked on WBs. You can opt to go to NB CA and the seat lock doesn't apply. There is at least one other way to get out of the seat lock, but no need to get that detailed for this discussion.
I don't think any of the cargo carriers overnight in PEK, PVG etc for now.
01-24-2022, 03:21 PM
#584
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: guppy CA
Posts: 5,171
You guys were wondering why WB FO is going junior. I provided an answer. You guys are welcome to lawyer my response as much as you like, but there are still more than a few countries that use complete lockdowns as their response to Covid.
Until Covid restrictions end worldwide, there will be pilots who take a hard pass on WB FO.
Anyone's welcome to get hired at United and take a WB FO position pretty much straight to WB FO after indoc. Then they can report first hand why they think WB FO's going junior.
01-24-2022, 08:34 PM
#585
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,595
I understand. United still flies to most of those cities.
You guys were wondering why WB FO is going junior. I provided an answer. You guys are welcome to lawyer my response as much as you like, but there are still more than a few countries that use complete lockdowns as their response to Covid.
Until Covid restrictions end worldwide, there will be pilots who take a hard pass on WB FO.
Anyone's welcome to get hired at United and take a WB FO position pretty much straight to WB FO after indoc. Then they can report first hand why they think WB FO's going junior.
You guys were wondering why WB FO is going junior. I provided an answer. You guys are welcome to lawyer my response as much as you like, but there are still more than a few countries that use complete lockdowns as their response to Covid.
Until Covid restrictions end worldwide, there will be pilots who take a hard pass on WB FO.
Anyone's welcome to get hired at United and take a WB FO position pretty much straight to WB FO after indoc. Then they can report first hand why they think WB FO's going junior.
01-24-2022, 09:30 PM
#586
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,230
01-25-2022, 03:01 AM
#587
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: guppy CA
Posts: 5,171
I'm sure even with being able to leave the hotel, it still sucks in SYD. I had an overnight in CYVR and even though you don't need to do a PCR test and aren't restricted to the hotel, it's not the same city.
I was required to show my vax card everywhere I ate and the streets were pretty empty. It was not quite a ghost town, but close enough. Very little life/movement in the city. Lots of things were closed.
Even NYC, as shut down as it is, probably has more things to do than most international destinations right now.
This is why WB FO isn't desirable at the moment in my opinion. But again, all of you are welcome to get hired at United, take a WB FO job right after indoc, and then write your opinion as to why WB FO goes so junior.
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