Line construction?
04-12-2019, 08:53 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 257
You could be right...
Or, perhaps...some of us are less enthusiastic because trip averaging is still in place and the long layover trigger moves from 22 to 24 hours.
You could see 10 hour 3 days, or 20 hour 4-days....start late enough on day 1, and you could see 15 hour 4 days.
And, they have an optimizer set to their specs, not ours.
Or, perhaps...some of us are less enthusiastic because trip averaging is still in place and the long layover trigger moves from 22 to 24 hours.
You could see 10 hour 3 days, or 20 hour 4-days....start late enough on day 1, and you could see 15 hour 4 days.
And, they have an optimizer set to their specs, not ours.
04-12-2019, 09:17 AM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,269
Line construction?
You could be right...
Or, perhaps...some of us are less enthusiastic because trip averaging is still in place and the long layover trigger moves from 22 to 24 hours.
You could see 10 hour 3 days, or 20 hour 4-days....start late enough on day 1, and you could see 15 hour 4 days.
And, they have an optimizer set to their specs, not ours.
Or, perhaps...some of us are less enthusiastic because trip averaging is still in place and the long layover trigger moves from 22 to 24 hours.
You could see 10 hour 3 days, or 20 hour 4-days....start late enough on day 1, and you could see 15 hour 4 days.
And, they have an optimizer set to their specs, not ours.
Show me an example of a 3 day worth 10 hours, I’m honestly curious how your math works to get this. I’m assuming you think you’ll have two duty periods and the TAFB will be less than 35 hours and it won’t have a “long overnight”. But any 3 day with only two duty periods should have a long overnight in there unless you end at like 2 am on the 3rd day, then it’s basically a late finishing 2 day and the later it finishes the more the 3.5 rig starts adding up. As for a 15 hour 4 day. That means your TAFB would have to be less than 52.5 hours and have 3 or less duty periods which would obviously add a long overnight into the equation. I can’t make the math work but I’m genuinely curious to see how you’re getting these numbers.
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04-12-2019, 09:44 AM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 257
Show me an example of a 3 day worth 10 hours, I’m honestly curious how your math works to get this. I’m assuming you think you’ll have two duty periods and the TAFB will be less than 35 hours and it won’t have a “long overnight”. But any 3 day with only two duty periods should have a long overnight in there unless you end at like 2 am on the 3rd day, then it’s basically a late finishing 2 day and the later it finishes the more the 3.5 rig starts adding up. As for a 15 hour 4 day. That means your TAFB would have to be less than 52.5 hours and have 3 or less duty periods which would obviously add a long overnight into the equation. I can’t make the math work but I’m genuinely curious to see how you’re getting these numbers.
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16 hour 4 day (15 hour 4 day would be nearly impossible to build) - Very late pm show (2300-2359), early am finish (before 0700 am) on day 4 (3 duty periods and one long layover but less than 24 hours).
Not great trips but again the point is that at least they are very commutable. These will most likely go to junior line holding commuters with PBS. Less days off due to inefficiencies but 100% commutable. Most likely better than what junior line holders are currently getting with line bidding especially considering commutability.
04-12-2019, 09:53 AM
#24
Line holder
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: On the bus,seat 0A
Posts: 3,345
Show me an example of a 3 day worth 10 hours, I’m honestly curious how your math works to get this. I’m assuming you think you’ll have two duty periods and the TAFB will be less than 35 hours and it won’t have a “long overnight”. But any 3 day with only two duty periods should have a long overnight in there unless you end at like 2 am on the 3rd day, then it’s basically a late finishing 2 day and the later it finishes the more the 3.5 rig starts adding up. As for a 15 hour 4 day. That means your TAFB would have to be less than 52.5 hours and have 3 or less duty periods which would obviously add a long overnight into the equation. I can’t make the math work but I’m genuinely curious to see how you’re getting these numbers.
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11pm red-eye day 1
23 hours rest
Early morning back to base ETA 8AM
Currently would pay 13:30 (EWR turns)
15 hour 4 day would more likely be at least 16 hr because of the new rigs:
11 pm red-eye
20 hr rest
Early east coast turn (BOS-BWI-BOS)
15 hour rest
Early return to base arrive 7am
TAFB 56 hrs, pay 16 hrs
Personally would bid the 4 days, like starting late on day1.
04-12-2019, 09:58 AM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,269
10 hr 3 day trip - Very late pm show (2200-2359) for a red eye, early am finish (0700-0900) on day 3 (2 duty periods and one long layover but less than 24 hours).
16 hour 4 day (15 hour 4 day would be nearly impossible to build) - Very late pm show (2300-2359), early am finish (before 0700 am) on day 4 (3 duty periods and one long layover but less than 24 hours).
Not great trips but again the point is that at least they are commutable. These will most likely go to junior line holding commuters with PBS. Less days off due to inefficiencies but 100% commutable. Most likely better than what junior line holders are currently getting with line bidding especially considering commutability.
16 hour 4 day (15 hour 4 day would be nearly impossible to build) - Very late pm show (2300-2359), early am finish (before 0700 am) on day 4 (3 duty periods and one long layover but less than 24 hours).
Not great trips but again the point is that at least they are commutable. These will most likely go to junior line holding commuters with PBS. Less days off due to inefficiencies but 100% commutable. Most likely better than what junior line holders are currently getting with line bidding especially considering commutability.
Fair enough, I’m gonna go out on a limb and say they are going to be outliers and garbage trips. But you’re correct. With PBS you will be able to avoid or request these types of extremely commutable trips.
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04-12-2019, 10:03 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,269
Line construction?
LAS, 3 Day TAFB 33 hours, pay 10 hrs
11pm red-eye day 1
23 hours rest
Early morning back to base ETA 8AM
Currently would pay 13:30 (EWR turns)
15 hour 4 day would more likely be at least 16 hr because of the new rigs:
11 pm red-eye
20 hr rest
Early east coast turn (BOS-BWI-BOS)
15 hour rest
Early return to base arrive 7am
TAFB 56 hrs, pay 16 hrs
Personally would bid the 4 days, like starting late on day1.
11pm red-eye day 1
23 hours rest
Early morning back to base ETA 8AM
Currently would pay 13:30 (EWR turns)
15 hour 4 day would more likely be at least 16 hr because of the new rigs:
11 pm red-eye
20 hr rest
Early east coast turn (BOS-BWI-BOS)
15 hour rest
Early return to base arrive 7am
TAFB 56 hrs, pay 16 hrs
Personally would bid the 4 days, like starting late on day1.
What kind of redeye are you doing where you can have 20 hours rest and do an early morning turn. Let’s say Vegas to Boston or LA to FLL are some of our longer ones. It’s blocked at what, 5 hours? You get in at 5 or 6 am. Add 20 hours to 6 am and it’s 2 am. I mean you guys are right. On paper you can make it work. But realistically with our schedule it doesn’t work.
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Last edited by TrojanCMH; 04-12-2019 at 10:15 AM.
04-12-2019, 10:09 AM
#29
Line holder
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: On the bus,seat 0A
Posts: 3,345
What kind of redeye are you doing where you can have 20 hours rest and do an early morning turn. Let’s say Vegas to Boston or LA to FLL are some of our longer ones. It’s blocked at what, 5 hours? You get in at 5 or 6 am. Add 20 hours to 6 am and it’s 2 am. I mean you guys are right. On paper you can make it work. But realistically with our schedule it doesn’t work.
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