This thing is a NO!
02-09-2018, 07:33 PM
#291
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2017
Position: NK CA
Posts: 838
3. The Company may enter into a code-share agreement, a marketing agreement, an
interline agreement, a pro-rate agreement, block space agreement, revenue sharing
agreement or joint venture so long as any such agreement does not result in the furlough
of any of the Company's pilots, or a reduction in system-wide block hours scheduled to
be performed by the Company’s pilots when measured as of the completion of each
trailing period of 12 calendar months after the effective date of such agreement (e.g.
March 2018 – February 2019) to the previous period of the same twelve months (March
2017-February 2018). The Company will not participate in revenue sharing or joint
ventures agreements with other carriers in which Spirit pilots do not perform a portion of
the flying to the extent the flying subject to the revenue sharing or joint venture is
permitted to be flown by, and is accessible to, the Company.
We may not "limit" their codesharing, but with this language it makes it difficult for the company and at least keeps our jobs intact. There is no ALPA pilot contract that "limits" the number of code sharing agreements to my knowledge. Even Southwest is currently shopping potential codeshare partners. I know you hate it but the scope language in this TA is pretty darn industry standard.
interline agreement, a pro-rate agreement, block space agreement, revenue sharing
agreement or joint venture so long as any such agreement does not result in the furlough
of any of the Company's pilots, or a reduction in system-wide block hours scheduled to
be performed by the Company’s pilots when measured as of the completion of each
trailing period of 12 calendar months after the effective date of such agreement (e.g.
March 2018 – February 2019) to the previous period of the same twelve months (March
2017-February 2018). The Company will not participate in revenue sharing or joint
ventures agreements with other carriers in which Spirit pilots do not perform a portion of
the flying to the extent the flying subject to the revenue sharing or joint venture is
permitted to be flown by, and is accessible to, the Company.
We may not "limit" their codesharing, but with this language it makes it difficult for the company and at least keeps our jobs intact. There is no ALPA pilot contract that "limits" the number of code sharing agreements to my knowledge. Even Southwest is currently shopping potential codeshare partners. I know you hate it but the scope language in this TA is pretty darn industry standard.
02-09-2018, 07:44 PM
#292
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
3. The Company may enter into a code-share agreement, a marketing agreement, an
interline agreement, a pro-rate agreement, block space agreement, revenue sharing
agreement or joint venture so long as any such agreement does not result in the furlough
of any of the Company's pilots, or a reduction in system-wide block hours scheduled to
be performed by the Company’s pilots when measured as of the completion of each
trailing period of 12 calendar months after the effective date of such agreement (e.g.
March 2018 – February 2019) to the previous period of the same twelve months (March
2017-February 2018). The Company will not participate in revenue sharing or joint
ventures agreements with other carriers in which Spirit pilots do not perform a portion of
the flying to the extent the flying subject to the revenue sharing or joint venture is
permitted to be flown by, and is accessible to, the Company.
We may not "limit" their codesharing, but with this language it makes it difficult for the company and at least keeps our jobs intact. There is no ALPA pilot contract that "limits" the number of code sharing agreements to my knowledge. Even Southwest is currently shopping potential codeshare partners. I know you hate it but the scope language in this TA is pretty darn industry standard.
interline agreement, a pro-rate agreement, block space agreement, revenue sharing
agreement or joint venture so long as any such agreement does not result in the furlough
of any of the Company's pilots, or a reduction in system-wide block hours scheduled to
be performed by the Company’s pilots when measured as of the completion of each
trailing period of 12 calendar months after the effective date of such agreement (e.g.
March 2018 – February 2019) to the previous period of the same twelve months (March
2017-February 2018). The Company will not participate in revenue sharing or joint
ventures agreements with other carriers in which Spirit pilots do not perform a portion of
the flying to the extent the flying subject to the revenue sharing or joint venture is
permitted to be flown by, and is accessible to, the Company.
We may not "limit" their codesharing, but with this language it makes it difficult for the company and at least keeps our jobs intact. There is no ALPA pilot contract that "limits" the number of code sharing agreements to my knowledge. Even Southwest is currently shopping potential codeshare partners. I know you hate it but the scope language in this TA is pretty darn industry standard.
02-09-2018, 07:50 PM
#293
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,861
3. The Company may enter into a code-share agreement, a marketing agreement, an
interline agreement, a pro-rate agreement, block space agreement, revenue sharing
agreement or joint venture so long as any such agreement does not result in the furlough
of any of the Company's pilots, or a reduction in system-wide block hours scheduled to
be performed by the Company’s pilots when measured as of the completion of each
trailing period of 12 calendar months after the effective date of such agreement (e.g.
March 2018 – February 2019) to the previous period of the same twelve months (March
2017-February 2018). The Company will not participate in revenue sharing or joint
ventures agreements with other carriers in which Spirit pilots do not perform a portion of
the flying to the extent the flying subject to the revenue sharing or joint venture is
permitted to be flown by, and is accessible to, the Company.
We may not "limit" their codesharing, but with this language it makes it difficult for the company and at least keeps our jobs intact. There is no ALPA pilot contract that "limits" the number of code sharing agreements to my knowledge. Even Southwest is currently shopping potential codeshare partners. I know you hate it but the scope language in this TA is pretty darn industry standard.
interline agreement, a pro-rate agreement, block space agreement, revenue sharing
agreement or joint venture so long as any such agreement does not result in the furlough
of any of the Company's pilots, or a reduction in system-wide block hours scheduled to
be performed by the Company’s pilots when measured as of the completion of each
trailing period of 12 calendar months after the effective date of such agreement (e.g.
March 2018 – February 2019) to the previous period of the same twelve months (March
2017-February 2018). The Company will not participate in revenue sharing or joint
ventures agreements with other carriers in which Spirit pilots do not perform a portion of
the flying to the extent the flying subject to the revenue sharing or joint venture is
permitted to be flown by, and is accessible to, the Company.
We may not "limit" their codesharing, but with this language it makes it difficult for the company and at least keeps our jobs intact. There is no ALPA pilot contract that "limits" the number of code sharing agreements to my knowledge. Even Southwest is currently shopping potential codeshare partners. I know you hate it but the scope language in this TA is pretty darn industry standard.
02-09-2018, 08:17 PM
#294
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2017
Position: NK CA
Posts: 838
It’s not! Have you read the other contracts? When they add codeshare they have to add company pilots/planes/block hours as well. In some cases it’s on the exact same city pair and in some cases it has to be block hours on the same type of aircraft as the partner company is using in the agreement. The ratios and language varies but there is always restrictions. Dosmestic codesharing is also heavily restricted if not prohibited. They cannot grow limitlessly with nonseniority pilots. Let’s also remember that those codeshares also contribute to profits and those pilots share in those profits.
02-09-2018, 08:20 PM
#295
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2017
Position: NK CA
Posts: 838
Hmm well for starters United and Alaska have no "alter ego, or change in control" in their current contracts. JB has no subcontracting, alter-ego, codesharing, or regional protections AT ALL. Thos as well go for Alaska which also do not have Fragmentation/Transfer of Assets protections.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
02-10-2018, 03:57 AM
#296
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
Hmm well for starters United and Alaska have no "alter ego, or change in control" in their current contracts. JB has no subcontracting, alter-ego, codesharing, or regional protections AT ALL. Thos as well go for Alaska which also do not have Fragmentation/Transfer of Assets protections.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
Jetblue has no scope because they don’t have a contract and all of the widebody flying the company sells tickets on is codeshare. All of it.
United has 13,000 pilots. Do you think they are going to start an alter-ego. They have very specific codesharing restrictions. The company is also trying to negotiate loosened scope as we speak. The contract is very specific and the only way they can grow now is with united pilots. Also I believe the FA contract requires merger in aquisition but I’d have to get that verified.
Last edited by Qotsaautopilot; 02-10-2018 at 04:07 AM.
02-10-2018, 05:13 AM
#297
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,861
Hmm well for starters United and Alaska have no "alter ego, or change in control" in their current contracts. JB has no subcontracting, alter-ego, codesharing, or regional protections AT ALL. Thos as well go for Alaska which also do not have Fragmentation/Transfer of Assets protections.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
02-10-2018, 09:00 AM
#298
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Position: A320 CA
Posts: 721
02-10-2018, 09:09 AM
#299
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
Hmm well for starters United and Alaska have no "alter ego, or change in control" in their current contracts. JB has no subcontracting, alter-ego, codesharing, or regional protections AT ALL. Thos as well go for Alaska which also do not have Fragmentation/Transfer of Assets protections.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
So maybe sir you should do some reading on current contracts in regards to scope.
Further, 1.C.2, 1.C.3, and 1.C.4 in the united contract deals with codesharing not even including united express and it covers 7 pages. We have a paragraph
Last edited by Qotsaautopilot; 02-10-2018 at 09:43 AM.
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