Section 3: Compensation
02-08-2018, 06:58 AM
#171
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Posts: 468
Yes and more than E-190 CA at AA.
Why are you using Delta? Let me guess because they have 65 hr guarantee which gives you 7 hours of additional pay to justify your monthly income...
Lets use AA....
5 year CA 320
- Pay: $256.26
- LC Reserve: 72 hours (same as in your new TA) except we are not on-call for 24 hrs.
- 401K 16% ( difference 5%)
———-AMERICAN ——————— SPIRIT————- -- DIFFERENCE
Monthly: $18,450.72...............$14,544.00............NEG $3,906.72
Annually: $221,408.64...........$174,528.00..........NEG $46,880.64
401K: $35,425.38..................$19,198.00............ NEG $16,227.27
Combined: $256,834.02...........$193,726.............NEG $63,108.02
* Anyone hired today will upgrade in 5 years *
* Aug we go to 5:15 min day.. that’s 83 guarantee with 14 days off.. add those numbers up.
Why are you using Delta? Let me guess because they have 65 hr guarantee which gives you 7 hours of additional pay to justify your monthly income...
Lets use AA....
5 year CA 320
- Pay: $256.26
- LC Reserve: 72 hours (same as in your new TA) except we are not on-call for 24 hrs.
- 401K 16% ( difference 5%)
———-AMERICAN ——————— SPIRIT————- -- DIFFERENCE
Monthly: $18,450.72...............$14,544.00............NEG $3,906.72
Annually: $221,408.64...........$174,528.00..........NEG $46,880.64
401K: $35,425.38..................$19,198.00............ NEG $16,227.27
Combined: $256,834.02...........$193,726.............NEG $63,108.02
* Anyone hired today will upgrade in 5 years *
* Aug we go to 5:15 min day.. that’s 83 guarantee with 14 days off.. add those numbers up.
02-08-2018, 07:02 AM
#172
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 482
June CA award - 11,107 (PHL 320 FO awarded LGA 737 CA)
Nov New Hire - 14,900
Projected Retirement (see pic)
So a new hire needs to move up 3,800, realistically around 3,000 as guys will go to widebody or pass upgrade for other reasons.
2022 - 3,636 will retire.
2026 - 7,385 will retire.
Junior wide-body CA (JFK 767) is a 5,000 number. That 12 years of retirements.
02-08-2018, 07:11 AM
#173
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 482
Right now, zero. Whats your point? Want to talk about 10 years CAs or wait a year before the 5 year guys start upgrading? We can talk about narrow body FOs making as much as Spirit CAs... maybe slightly less.
I’m not trying to argue, simply showing that your proposed scale is not industry standard, and goes backwards as the time goes on. Nothing personal man.
I’m not trying to argue, simply showing that your proposed scale is not industry standard, and goes backwards as the time goes on. Nothing personal man.
02-08-2018, 07:14 AM
#174
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,542
No guarantee when talking about the future either. At one point at airways, werent Majority of F/Os a CA at one point?, lol
Have to use current #s and current #s still have us further behind.
We could look at DALs 747 top CA RATES of $200/hr from 2011-ish and feeeeel pretty good about oursleves or Airways top A320CA RATES OF $125 lol but whats the point. Gotta compare current stuff
Have to use current #s and current #s still have us further behind.
We could look at DALs 747 top CA RATES of $200/hr from 2011-ish and feeeeel pretty good about oursleves or Airways top A320CA RATES OF $125 lol but whats the point. Gotta compare current stuff
02-08-2018, 07:20 AM
#175
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 482
Well put man! Couldn’t agree more.
USAirway, not sure but I know guys who were hired months apart and have 15+ in upgrade. Like you said “no guarantees”. I think your TA is 100% a step in the right direction BUT could be better.
02-08-2018, 07:30 AM
#176
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2017
Posts: 144
See, go to reeducation camp roadshow, take blue pill. All will be fine. This guy did it. Look how happy he is.
02-08-2018, 08:20 AM
#177
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,542
Absolutely, don't think anyone can argue that.
02-08-2018, 08:20 AM
#178
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 279
The really sad part is all the top legacy comparisons fall by the way side thanks to the NMB and the AK/VA arbitration award. The only comparable airlines they used and will use for us if we vote this down is AK, JB, F9 and Aly Giant. Guys need to get this through their heads.
02-08-2018, 08:40 AM
#179
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,542
The really sad part is all the top legacy comparisons fall by the way side thanks to the NMB and the AK/VA arbitration award. The only comparable airlines they used and will use for us if we vote this down is AK, JB, F9 and Aly Giant. Guys need to get this through their heads.
I understand this in terms of the NMB declaring an impasse etc but it doesnt really mean anything outside of that. We arent in arbitration, its mediation. There job is to get us to move along and just meet, apply pressure etc
The NMB doesnt pay us to fly, the Airline does. Our mgmt could pay us DAL +1 if they wanted to, NMB would’nt tell them they couldnt.
02-08-2018, 09:50 AM
#180
Line holder
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: On the bus,seat 0A
Posts: 3,345
Do you have numbers to support 8 years? Here’s where’re I’m getting my numbers..
June CA award - 11,107 (PHL 320 FO awarded LGA 737 CA)
Nov New Hire - 14,900
Projected Retirement (see pic)
So a new hire needs to move up 3,800, realistically around 3,000 as guys will go to widebody or pass upgrade for other reasons.
2022 - 3,636 will retire.
2026 - 7,385 will retire.
Junior wide-body CA (JFK 767) is a 5,000 number. That 12 years of retirements.
June CA award - 11,107 (PHL 320 FO awarded LGA 737 CA)
Nov New Hire - 14,900
Projected Retirement (see pic)
So a new hire needs to move up 3,800, realistically around 3,000 as guys will go to widebody or pass upgrade for other reasons.
2022 - 3,636 will retire.
2026 - 7,385 will retire.
Junior wide-body CA (JFK 767) is a 5,000 number. That 12 years of retirements.
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