Planepirate

-Average stage length =991
-Average seat capacity =182 (I added up the total seats in the fleet divided by the number of aircraft).
-CASM ex-fuel = 5.42

So therefore the average cost for each flight would be:

(182)(0.0542)(991)= 9775.62.

That means our average flight costs $9775 to operate (not counting fuel).

That flight would take about 2 hours. A $100k/ year raise would equate to about $100 per hour per pilot. So this flight would cost the company roughly $400 more to operate. Total of $10,175.

(182)(991)(C)=10,175
(180,362)(C)=10,175
C=0.0564
Our new CASM would be 5.64

As I said... industry leading. And that’s not even factoring in any efficiencies the company will gain in the new contract.

Lincoln Osiris

Wow, very well done. It would be nice if the union would do sh!t like this.

Planepirate

We can agree to disagree on this point. In my opinion there is a huge difference between Motel 6 and the Sheraton. A coach seat on Spirit really isn’t too much different than a coach seat on anyone else. The difference between Spirit and the rest of the industry is the negative perception we have. That started with Baldanza and Fornaro hasn’t done much to change that. Becoming a more reliable airline would be a good start. Treating your employees well would make all the difference in the world. The “High five” campaign is a perfect example of how our management is disconnected with reality. You can’t, as a manager, have a system to reward people who go above and beyond, while at the same time you continually abuse your employees for no reason. A recurring theme recently is that they don’t book your hotel or transportation correctly (if at all) when you get a reserve assignment. If the above would prevent you from completing an assignment, they are johnny-on-the-spot. If you are going into a long rest or days off, they couldn’t care less. The list goes on and on. When it comes to PBS... if this Management didn’t have a history of trying to screw us at every turn I don’t think most would be opposed to it. That, unfortunately, is not the case.

Every mention of “team” and “Spirit family” etc in the most recent earnings call made me vomit in my mouth a little bit.

sulkair

Well then why did SW always pay so well even in the days when they didn't have the economies of scale the big 3 have? Or did they pay way less at one point?

Name User

Prior to 9/11 SWA pay paled in comparison to the legacies. Back then I mean NWA, USAir, Delta, United, even Continental.

SWA was big on stock awards as a form of payment and hired mostly ex-mil that didn’t need their crappy healthcare coverage.

That’s kinda the evolution of things, pretty much any startup follows the same path. I’m sure SWA will improve more in the future, they have 700 airplanes for Pete’s sake. Their profit was almost as much as AA with half the airplanes.

Feng

I think this train of thought is excellent...actually using numbers to convey a point. Excellent write up, a couple things that'll be hard but needs to be factored in to the amount of increase in CASM.

1. Unless you're departing the gate going 500mph and arriving at 500mph with no taxing time, I'm not sure 2 hrs for 991 miles is doable. More like 2:35 maybe?

2. In your equations, you only accounted for the direct impact of the pilots working that specific flight to the CASM. It would be accurate if the airline paid the total of its pilots the same credits hours as its block hours. How any pilots on reserve work 100-300 hours a year and gets paid 900-1000? Or line holders that block 800/yr and credit 1000-1200 via transition, sick, vacation, etc...Those unblocked credit increase the CASM that's not accounted for in your equation.

Does that make sense? If not I'll try to be clearer.

3. Other things

Though an interesting and valid way of looking at the number, it makes it harder to quantify. I feel a better way is to simply add what the contract increases are worth as a whole and add/subtract from the balance sheet to get the figures you're looking for.

Truly not trying to troll. Just enjoy these discussions.

P56C

Do not feed the troll. Stop.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

Lincoln Osiris

We are not breaking any "rules" by talking about economics and trying to understand the numbers since the union has taken a "take our word for it" type of stance. If you don't like it then I suggest you hit that log out button.

sulkair

Interesting. I wasn't aware.

Feng

Yeah man, SWA never caught up to the legacies. After 9/11 and the bankruptcies, all the big boys dipped way below SWA pay thus making them one of the highest paid carriers out there. Believe it or not, I can see it happen again. Frontier and Spirit make modest gains, big recession hits, everyone else furloughs and take concessions to match or below ULCC compensation.

We'll have to agree to disagree on the hotel comparison. In the end a hotel is just a place to stay and and airline is just a seat and a means of transportation. But it's everything and all the details in the middle that differentiates them. I sympathize with crappy treatment. It seems systemic to a bare bones operation infrastructure, just the way they wanted. But when they're making this much money, you'd think they'd try to spend some money and try to streamline things a bit.