Hello PBS; Goodbye QOL
10-28-2017, 05:38 PM
#51
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2017
Posts: 81
I guess it’s because the reasoning you guys use behind what you think you deserve is simply the most illogical thinking I’ve seen anywhere. Refute what I say, don’t attack the messenger. Oh and have you considered that I’m a woman?So you're just trying to help us out of the kindness of your heart? I do appreciate it but I feel your time and energy could be put to more important things.
I'm curious, what do you do for work?
10-28-2017, 05:44 PM
#52
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2017
Position: Discount Pilot
Posts: 183
I had a pretty good PBS experience at my POS regional airline and I assume PBS as implemented at/by Spirit would be nothing like it was there.
10-28-2017, 06:52 PM
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 227
Well here’s one thought that I don’t actually know the answer to. NK is a low revenue operation. Wouldn’t it be a fairer compensation comparison using say, legacy pilot CASM / RASM to get a percentage, and use that percentage and multiply it by NK’s RASM to see what NK’s pilot cost per ASM should be and then translate it to an hourly rate.
You can hardly expect NK to pay legacy wages when each flight generate less revenue than a non-Ultra discount product.
I suspect the mediator has the same line of thinking.
You can hardly expect NK to pay legacy wages when each flight generate less revenue than a non-Ultra discount product.
I suspect the mediator has the same line of thinking.
10-28-2017, 06:56 PM
#54
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 227
Now that you mention it... you don’t listen to reason and you refuse to admit you’re wrong. Lol
10-28-2017, 08:55 PM
#55
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2016
Posts: 612
That dirty POS doesn't work for anyone, that's why he will never answer that question. Just a terrible troll
10-28-2017, 09:58 PM
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
This was not the Alpa proposal. It was the company proposal to include pbs. If that was the Alpa proposal we would have much much bigger problems
10-29-2017, 01:14 AM
#58
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 316
I’m a little tired here so forgive me if I totally miss the mark, but wouldn’t CASM/RASM also be called our operating margin? If you adjusted our pay so that we would have industry standard margins, I wonder what the pay rates would equate to.. we do have pretty high margins. Using your method, the data could show we should be the highest paid pilots in the world. But who knows... Maybe Great Lakes has a higher margin. Your formula may show they should be paid the most.
10-29-2017, 02:15 AM
#59
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 316
I was not referring to the entirety of the CASM, just the pilot compensation portion of the CASM. So essentially figuring out what percentage of the company's RASM goes to pilot compensation at various airlines and how it compared to NK. I think that’d be an interesting data point.
Say on any given flight, for simplicity, NK takes in $110 in revenue and DAL takes in $150.
NK’s cost are $30 for airplane / $30 for Fuel / $20 labor / $7 for misc operation and infrastructure, for a total cost of $87 in cost out of $110 in revenue.
Delta on the other hand, $27 for airplane / $30 for fuel /$45 labor /$20 misc, $122 cost out of $150 revenue. Labor account for 30% of the revnue.
If NK spent 30% of its revenue on labor, or $33. totaling the cost to $100 of $110, will reduce the profit margins substantially. And that’s not even coming close to spending DAL’s $45 in labor for the same flight, only matching on a percentage basis.
There are probably problems with my example, but I think the jist of it is right.
That’s why I think the mediator laughed at ALPA’s economic analysis saying their proposal only increases the CASM by a penny.
10-29-2017, 02:38 AM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2017
Position: NK CA
Posts: 853
On second though, that metric would only tell you what an airline can and cannot afford.
Say on any given flight, for simplicity, NK takes in $110 in revenue and DAL takes in $150.
NK’s cost are $30 for airplane / $30 for Fuel / $20 labor / $7 for misc operation and infrastructure, for a total cost of $87 in cost out of $110 in revenue.
Delta on the other hand, $27 for airplane / $30 for fuel /$45 labor /$20 misc, $122 cost out of $150 revenue. Labor account for 30% of the revnue.
If NK spent 30% of its revenue on labor, or $33. totaling the cost to $100 of $110, will reduce the profit margins substantially. And that’s not even coming close to spending DAL’s $45 in labor for the same flight, only matching on a percentage basis.
There are probably problems with my example, but I think the jist of it is right.
That’s why I think the mediator laughed at ALPA’s economic analysis saying their proposal only increases the CASM by a penny.
Say on any given flight, for simplicity, NK takes in $110 in revenue and DAL takes in $150.
NK’s cost are $30 for airplane / $30 for Fuel / $20 labor / $7 for misc operation and infrastructure, for a total cost of $87 in cost out of $110 in revenue.
Delta on the other hand, $27 for airplane / $30 for fuel /$45 labor /$20 misc, $122 cost out of $150 revenue. Labor account for 30% of the revnue.
If NK spent 30% of its revenue on labor, or $33. totaling the cost to $100 of $110, will reduce the profit margins substantially. And that’s not even coming close to spending DAL’s $45 in labor for the same flight, only matching on a percentage basis.
There are probably problems with my example, but I think the jist of it is right.
That’s why I think the mediator laughed at ALPA’s economic analysis saying their proposal only increases the CASM by a penny.
UPDATE: Went and did some digging and saw that for the Q3 reports for example Southwest had a CASM (operating cost per available seat mile) of 11.36 (cents) and Delta had a operating cost of 12.61 cents (mainline only). While Spirit "HA" was only at 5.42 cents cost per available seat mile. But they can't afford to pay us right? haha kiss my ass Fornaro. Go back and try to run Air Tran into the ground again or something.
Last edited by Lincoln Osiris; 10-29-2017 at 02:59 AM.
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