Justdoinmyjob

No, they just had to apply, land an interview, and spend a year on probation without union representation at AAI. Bonus, they didn't have to shell out money for a type. The company paid for it, like they are supposed to. (BTW, requiring an employee to pay for their own type is the last vestiges of PFT.)

The bigger question is however, did they want to wake up one morning and see that their company was being bought? As for a superior contract, how long has it been one? And what will your argument be when it no longer is?

As a competitor, the best outcome for me is to have SWA choke on the AAI sandwich as it's going down. Will it kill you? No, but anything that puts a company that competes against mine at a disadvantage is welcomed. As a unionist, any infighting between us only gives managements at all airlines more legroom to screw us all.

SWA may have a copacetic relationship now. So did Delta until the 90s. We had a tradition of not furloughing for close to 60+ years, right up until we did the first time. Now, the "Family" is gone. SWA has only been around 40 years? Call me a pessimist, but one day the culture will be gone and it will just be "business as usual."

tsquare

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Smokey23

There are quite a few pilots that came to SWA from ATN. They all had to do the above. Why is that? Using your logic, I guess Delta shouldn't bother with vetting anyone interested in flying for them if they are already employed with another airline?

I stand by my original statement. The ATN pilots did have to lift a finger (or ten) to get hired at ATN, but they don't have to do anything now to get a SWA ID.

BTW, you just couldn't resist rolling out that tired old PFT dig? It did nothing to enhance your argument, and makes you sound bitter.

Considering they were just months away from a strike (to hear them tell it), I would bet the VAST majority of ATN pilots were quite happy on the morning of September 27, 2010.

It has been a superior contract to ATN's for the entire time ATN has been ATN....and when they were ValueJet, too.

Since ATN will cease to exist by next year, I can only assume this question is actually referencing Delta's contract....since you guys can't seem to help but weigh in on everything here whether it's all about you or not. I hope you can someday get your old rates restored plus inflation. If you are successful, I will gracefully cede the title "Industry Leading" back to you studs.

I appreciate your candor. The feeling is mutual. It's a dog eat dog industry.

You may be right.

Justdoinmyjob

We're not talking about someone leaving a company to go somewhere else on their own accord. We're talking about the wholesale merger of an entire group. Yes, Delta interviews and starts individuals out at the bottom during a hiring wave. During a merger, you didn't see us do that to any NWA pilots, did you?

See above


Not bitter, just tired of that straw-man argument about the tremendous sacrifice it took to get a type. When I was furloughed, I had the opportunity to go to SWA. Have a cousin who has been an FA there since almost day one and my father was a personal friend of Herb's. Just didn't want to do work there.



Just because you are willing to strike against your company doesn't mean you hate it. It just means you are willing to do what may be necessary to force your management's hand in negotiations. You have never had to deal with that kind of management. Lord willing, you never will have to, but maybe one day you might. Then maybe you will understand.



No, our contract blows mighty big chunks.That said, tThere are certain things in yours I would like to see in ours, and some things I like in ours I'd like to keep. I was just saying that the "superior contract" argument is another non-starter because contracts change, and it's hard to justify your position further down the road when they do.



I'm not going to sugarcoat it. I'm looking forward to some competition in both NYC and ATL. When the smoke clears, my hope is that we are on top, and you guys are second. There is plenty of business to support that. The only glee I would take though, is seeing Clark Howard choke on his fanboy words.

At this juncture, I think that the deal is done. Regardless of what anyone posts here, the SWA and AAI pilots have to live with the bed they made. Good luck and may God have mercy on you all as the Delta Borgship continues the assimilation. Resistance is Futile!

tomgoodman

As a senior DAL pilot remarked: "Now it's just a job. A good one, yes, but it used to be much more than that."

OscartheGrouch

This statement in bold is what I said a while back. Many of those who dislike SWA are looking for a way to urinate in our pool. Why anyone would trust the opinion of those who wish us ill is beyond me. Their goal is to undermine and cause angst among the pilots of AT and SWA. With Tsquare in agreement I rest my case. Competing is one thing but wishing calamity on another is worthy of a psych eval.

Then they complain again about the type requirement because they have to make an excuse why they chose not to apply at SWA. I know, I know, you NEVER wanted to work for SWA. Glad it worked out for you.

The Oscar

P. S. I agree that our culture is an endangered and most likely on its death bed.

Herkulesdrvr

Where does it say a company is supposed to pay for a type rating? If you don't pay for a type rating then Southwest won't hire you simple as that.

LuvJockey

Delta Borgship assimilation? Only if you mean Delta management will end up booking tickets on your website and paying us to carry your passengers. That is traditional Delta assimilation, isn't it?

SlipKid

SW has hired many folks who've never laid out a dime for the type rating.

They require that you HAVE the rating.

It doesn't matter how or where you get it.

jc73drvr

I don't buy into the fact that people disagree with having to have a Type Rating. If it is thought of as unfair or excessive or PFT, then here are the realistic justifications for getting the type rating in order to fly for Southwest:
If the type rating cost let's say between $5000 - $10000 then subtract the amount paid from the first year salary at WN. You will still be quite ahead of first year pay at most other major airlines, if not all of them. The first year F/O can earn 55K-60K.

Also consider what you will earn in the following years- compared to other airlines.

Your treated quite well as a first year F/O on probation, all you got to do is show up for work with a positive attitude and do your best, not that hard to do. WN treats the new F/O great!

There are several ways to improve your schedule thus improving your quality of life! The options available may life better especially if you commute!

Great work rules for those who commute!

A company that treats people quite well!

These are just a few reasons why getting the type is worth so much more than the money it costs. Getting hired with WN is the bigger challenge (especially now a days).

Pilots will complain until their dead, and still sometimes it doesnt stop there. Nobody puts a gun to your head to say you have to do anything, but if you don't want to get the type, you wont get the job at WN.

I feel that AirTran pilots have had two very good offers from WN. Seniority means nothing if pay, quality of life, professional satisfaction are meager. If you were the most senior pilot at the worst airline would that make things better? Or would it be better to be juinor at an airline with much better career earnings, QOL, and actually being happy at work?