Southwest/AirTran deal easy landing
06-04-2011, 06:39 PM
#141
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 752
Not gonna happen in a post McCaskill-Bond world.
Saying otherwise is Troll (Internet) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Saying otherwise is Troll (Internet) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
06-04-2011, 07:04 PM
#142
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
Not gonna happen in a post McCaskill-Bond world.
Saying otherwise is Troll (Internet) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Saying otherwise is Troll (Internet) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Last edited by forgot to bid; 06-04-2011 at 08:31 PM.
06-04-2011, 07:20 PM
#143
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: CA
Posts: 1,207
GK has already informed SWAPA that the CBA does not prohibit codeshare with a wholy owned, it only prohibits codeshare with an outside airline. The codeshare begins in September.
The process agreement compells GK to file for single carrier status and combine under a SOC. There can be no liquidation of Guadaloupe prior to that. This agreement was signed by all four parties.
So there is no "leverage" on either side to accept a one-sided ISL. It will be arbitrated and we will all learn to live with it while the company doubles in size over the next 10 years.
The process agreement compells GK to file for single carrier status and combine under a SOC. There can be no liquidation of Guadaloupe prior to that. This agreement was signed by all four parties.
So there is no "leverage" on either side to accept a one-sided ISL. It will be arbitrated and we will all learn to live with it while the company doubles in size over the next 10 years.
Following the Merger Closing, Southwest and AirTran Airways would each
continue to operate as separate air carriers unless and until Southwest combines Southwest and AirTran Airways into a single air carrier.
As a consequence of Southwest’s acquisition of the stock of AirTran Holdings, Inc., Southwest and SWAPA wish to establish a mechanism for operating Southwest and AirTran as separate carriers until and unless Southwest combines AirTran and Southwest into a single carrier.
Coverage Date or Dates. The date or dates when the terms and conditions of employment of AirTran Pilots will be governed by the SWAPA CBA....The Coverage Date or Dates shall not be prior to Complete Operational Merger, or as otherwise agreed upon by Southwest and the SWAPA BOD or its designee.
06-04-2011, 08:37 PM
#144
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 752
FTB,
It is trolling. Along the same lines if I posted that I heard just the other day from some Pinnacle guys that Delta is giving them all the domestic flying and just keeping the International routes.
We all know that's BS, you know it's BS because you know there are signed documents (CBA, LOAs), that would prevent such an action.
Similar situation here. Besides the federal law, there is a 4-party Process Agreement that states the lists will be integrated. There is a signed letter from Gary Kelly stating McCaskill-Bond will be complied with.
It is trolling. Along the same lines if I posted that I heard just the other day from some Pinnacle guys that Delta is giving them all the domestic flying and just keeping the International routes.
We all know that's BS, you know it's BS because you know there are signed documents (CBA, LOAs), that would prevent such an action.
Similar situation here. Besides the federal law, there is a 4-party Process Agreement that states the lists will be integrated. There is a signed letter from Gary Kelly stating McCaskill-Bond will be complied with.
06-04-2011, 09:00 PM
#145
On Reserve
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: MSP7ERB
Posts: 1,886
FTB,
It is trolling. Along the same lines if I posted that I heard just the other day from some Pinnacle guys that Delta is giving them all the domestic flying and just keeping the International routes.
We all know that's BS, you know it's BS because you know there are signed documents (CBA, LOAs), that would prevent such an action.
Similar situation here. Besides the federal law, there is a 4-party Process Agreement that states the lists will be integrated. There is a signed letter from Gary Kelly stating McCaskill-Bond will be complied with.
It is trolling. Along the same lines if I posted that I heard just the other day from some Pinnacle guys that Delta is giving them all the domestic flying and just keeping the International routes.
We all know that's BS, you know it's BS because you know there are signed documents (CBA, LOAs), that would prevent such an action.
Similar situation here. Besides the federal law, there is a 4-party Process Agreement that states the lists will be integrated. There is a signed letter from Gary Kelly stating McCaskill-Bond will be complied with.
06-04-2011, 09:40 PM
#146
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 752
Of course it strikes a nerve. But, hopefully, one of the constructive results of this board, and others like it, is to dispel the really ridiculous rumors that float around out there.
I don't doubt there are AirTran guys out there saying stuff like this. I'm sure there are SWA guys saying the same thing. But you have to consider the source. AT has lots of ex-TWA guys who have been burned by the merger process. We also have a lot of ex-ATA guys who don't have happy memories of their last experience with SWA.
I don't doubt there are AirTran guys out there saying stuff like this. I'm sure there are SWA guys saying the same thing. But you have to consider the source. AT has lots of ex-TWA guys who have been burned by the merger process. We also have a lot of ex-ATA guys who don't have happy memories of their last experience with SWA.
06-05-2011, 04:26 AM
#147
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
Perhaps I'm naive and have a hard time believing this, but...I heard a rumor this week that SWA intended to keep the companies separate, sell the B717's, and get rid of Airtran crews as aircraft are divested, while simultaneously hiring on the SWA side. Any comments? Confirm or deny? It might be that data concerning this rumor was posted earlier and I simply missed it.
FTB,
It is trolling. Along the same lines if I posted that I heard just the other day from some Pinnacle guys that Delta is giving them all the domestic flying and just keeping the International routes.
We all know that's BS, you know it's BS because you know there are signed documents (CBA, LOAs), that would prevent such an action.
Similar situation here. Besides the federal law, there is a 4-party Process Agreement that states the lists will be integrated. There is a signed letter from Gary Kelly stating McCaskill-Bond will be complied with.
It is trolling. Along the same lines if I posted that I heard just the other day from some Pinnacle guys that Delta is giving them all the domestic flying and just keeping the International routes.
We all know that's BS, you know it's BS because you know there are signed documents (CBA, LOAs), that would prevent such an action.
Similar situation here. Besides the federal law, there is a 4-party Process Agreement that states the lists will be integrated. There is a signed letter from Gary Kelly stating McCaskill-Bond will be complied with.
I promise you Elvis isn't trolling, that stuff is out there and some of it is very well thought out and as far as I can tell, McCaskill-Bond wouldn't stop it. Maybe it would but maybe it wouldn't. Shutting off the debate prematurely would be like us shutting down a Skywest to buy Delta conversation - those things are fun to beat down but informative.
The 717s being sold is something that has hit news sites and is talked about A LOT at SWA. And DAL's headquarters. But it won't happen... in 2011. 2011 ends in a 6 months. That's the word I've heard.
06-05-2011, 05:06 AM
#148
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 752
FTB,
I hear what you are saying. 'trolling' may of been a bit harsh.
I'll answer the question another way. Every indication is SWA understands the 717 has been a big piece of AT's competitive advantage against Delta. I still believe that GK is a competent executive. Selling the 717's to DL smacks of that special kind of airline management madness that SWA has never demonstrated.
I hear what you are saying. 'trolling' may of been a bit harsh.
I'll answer the question another way. Every indication is SWA understands the 717 has been a big piece of AT's competitive advantage against Delta. I still believe that GK is a competent executive. Selling the 717's to DL smacks of that special kind of airline management madness that SWA has never demonstrated.
06-05-2011, 06:50 AM
#149
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,803
If SWA tried to sell the 717s and get rid of the proportionate number of AT pilots (which is absurd, but let's just say), they'd better keep it on the down low as long as possible and do it in one shot. I think the "culture" would suffer just a little bit if you know what I'm sayin'.
06-05-2011, 07:16 AM
#150
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Is GK bound to comply with it since McCaskill-Bond is law? At least when it comes to SLI?
I promise you Elvis isn't trolling, that stuff is out there and some of it is very well thought out and as far as I can tell, McCaskill-Bond wouldn't stop it. Maybe it would but maybe it wouldn't. Shutting off the debate prematurely would be like us shutting down a Skywest to buy Delta conversation - those things are fun to beat down but informative.
The 717s being sold is something that has hit news sites and is talked about A LOT at SWA. And DAL's headquarters. But it won't happen... in 2011. 2011 ends in a 6 months. That's the word I've heard.
I promise you Elvis isn't trolling, that stuff is out there and some of it is very well thought out and as far as I can tell, McCaskill-Bond wouldn't stop it. Maybe it would but maybe it wouldn't. Shutting off the debate prematurely would be like us shutting down a Skywest to buy Delta conversation - those things are fun to beat down but informative.
The 717s being sold is something that has hit news sites and is talked about A LOT at SWA. And DAL's headquarters. But it won't happen... in 2011. 2011 ends in a 6 months. That's the word I've heard.
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