Another incident ?
07-06-2024, 04:08 AM
#111
Spikes the Koolaid
Joined APC: Jul 2015
Position: 737
Posts: 403
Regarding the tournament players rushing, there's some conflating going on here. Yes tournament players taxi like they're on fire, but they also control their out times like heck. No tournament player would ever block out early and risk having to wait XX precious minutes for the tower to do their opening spiel. They watch that stuff like a hawk.
I don't control my minutes nearly as diligently as they do (because I'm a not a tournament player) because shaving every second off of a flight takes a lot of extra work, just like flying super slow does. It's one reason I'm very glad I don't commute any more. That last leg shave every second off was nerve wracking and exhausting. I get there when I get there now.
07-06-2024, 04:57 AM
#112
Gets Weekend Reserve
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,760
Wouldn't call myself a tournament player, maybe a weekend player?
Yes, I look to shave block time wherever possible, but....
No, I don't release the brakes to "get us on the clock" unless I'm already on premium or it serves other purpose.
No, I don't taxi 30 knots or slam people against the bulkheads or get people sick in the back.
No, I don't ignore ATC instructions or make up my own taxi instructions.
No, I don't ask to cut the line by asking for an intersection takeoff. One exception was getting very close to duty time limits in coordination with our dispatch, and ATC actually made us cut the line.
No, I don't ask for direct CKH when switched to LA Center going to HNL.
Care to guess how many times I would hustle here only to encounter no rampers or maybe some half lost ramper crossing wands and waiting for his 2 other buddies who take their sweetest time to casually stroll over only to find no wands, only to then keep strolling around looking for the said wands, only for them to find one pair and then spend the next 5 minutes looking for another set wands? Mind you, often times, no planes, vehicles, carts, or equipment anywhere near the side in question... You can hustle, get umpteen shortcuts, get lucky with ATC, you'll arrive at your destination to hopefully catch up, but ramp be like....
So no, you're spouting off urban housewife stories about taxiing just below V1. There are plenty of ways for us shave time or get rid of our block time. Usually involves trading, ELITT and low block trips, it doesn't involve ignoring ATC instructions or asking for intersection takeoffs.
Yes, I look to shave block time wherever possible, but....
No, I don't release the brakes to "get us on the clock" unless I'm already on premium or it serves other purpose.
No, I don't taxi 30 knots or slam people against the bulkheads or get people sick in the back.
No, I don't ignore ATC instructions or make up my own taxi instructions.
No, I don't ask to cut the line by asking for an intersection takeoff. One exception was getting very close to duty time limits in coordination with our dispatch, and ATC actually made us cut the line.
No, I don't ask for direct CKH when switched to LA Center going to HNL.
Care to guess how many times I would hustle here only to encounter no rampers or maybe some half lost ramper crossing wands and waiting for his 2 other buddies who take their sweetest time to casually stroll over only to find no wands, only to then keep strolling around looking for the said wands, only for them to find one pair and then spend the next 5 minutes looking for another set wands? Mind you, often times, no planes, vehicles, carts, or equipment anywhere near the side in question... You can hustle, get umpteen shortcuts, get lucky with ATC, you'll arrive at your destination to hopefully catch up, but ramp be like....
So no, you're spouting off urban housewife stories about taxiing just below V1. There are plenty of ways for us shave time or get rid of our block time. Usually involves trading, ELITT and low block trips, it doesn't involve ignoring ATC instructions or asking for intersection takeoffs.
07-06-2024, 07:41 AM
#113
It's 5 o'clock somewhere
Joined APC: Oct 2020
Posts: 2,151
Maybe we could start by removing the 99.9 pct of Notams that are utterly irrelevant to airline operations, like the endless stream of warnings regarding 50 foot cranes located 6 miles from the airport. If you're at 50' AGL 6 miles from the airport, you've got bigger problems. I'm not defending this crew; I wasn't there and I have no idea what really happened, but will it take another Comair 5191 to jolt the FAA into producing a notam system that actually focuses on the most prominent threats?
07-06-2024, 07:55 AM
#114
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,588
soo explain why they blocked out 10 early ???? How was this an incentive to “save block”…. And who gives a Fack about NOTAMAN when it’s on the AWOS/atis/ASOS…(whatever GA guys call it)….. just a plain old POOCHSCREW ….. but it has nothing to do with our schedule culture…..
07-06-2024, 09:27 AM
#115
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,016
Yes we do but you’re wrong on the second part. Reducing block can directly lead to being able to pick up more premium (1.5X) pay trips.
It’s exactly as SailingFun states……rushing is indeed built into the DNA of the pilot group, especially the ones that have been around longer.
That has fortunately become less and less of a “thing” over time but it is still very much a “thing”. Go ride some jumpseats of other airlines and then come ride a few of ours. Then let’s revisit this conversation.
It’s exactly as SailingFun states……rushing is indeed built into the DNA of the pilot group, especially the ones that have been around longer.
That has fortunately become less and less of a “thing” over time but it is still very much a “thing”. Go ride some jumpseats of other airlines and then come ride a few of ours. Then let’s revisit this conversation.
As an objective observer the old cowboy culture looks to be on the decline these days, and my friends at SW would concur. New generation.
07-06-2024, 09:30 AM
#116
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,016
07-06-2024, 12:04 PM
#117
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2022
Posts: 1,155
If you've been around 20+ years it was a definitely a thing in the past. Been on many jumpseats but you could also see it from your own cockpit regardless.
As an objective observer the old cowboy culture looks to be on the decline these days, and my friends at SW would concur. New generation.
As an objective observer the old cowboy culture looks to be on the decline these days, and my friends at SW would concur. New generation.
07-06-2024, 03:25 PM
#118
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,648
Ive witnessed it in the past and recently in the islands and on the mainland. Overtly cutting off and maneuvering without common courtesy. Uniquely Southwest. Wondered if it’s fostered or just becomes an expectation in the flight deck. There is a fine line of being proactive for the schedule and trying to avoid delays and getting “stuck” behind others. The blue and red planes cross it. Hopefully it doesn’t lead to careless or reckless results.
Been at swa for a decade and haven't witnessed that type of behavior at all. You sure seem to to spend a lot of time on here upset about things that Southwest doesn't do.
07-06-2024, 04:31 PM
#119
Gets Weekend Reserve
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,760
Ive witnessed it in the past and recently in the islands and on the mainland. Overtly cutting off and maneuvering without common courtesy. Uniquely Southwest. Wondered if it’s fostered or just becomes an expectation in the flight deck. There is a fine line of being proactive for the schedule and trying to avoid delays and getting “stuck” behind others. The blue and red planes cross it. Hopefully it doesn’t lead to careless or reckless results.
07-06-2024, 05:22 PM
#120
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2022
Posts: 1,155
Take this outside the WN thread and see how it goes.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
