WN Pilot Shortage
11-21-2022, 10:02 AM
#21
gets time off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,234
When did any SWA pilot’s seniority EVER suffer from any mergers/buyouts that SWA has entered into? Seriously, give me one example, because the last one the average relative seniority gain was 8% for SWAPA pilots and the loss for the losing side was an average of 22%.
I love flying with FOs that are like, “I really hope we don’t merge with anyone”. They obviously are clueless about SWAPA past merger history. If they were educated on it they’d be praying that we bought someone. I’m sure they’d get to enjoy some of those sweet “captured” captain seats.
Pulleeez. Spare me the bologna and let’s keep the facts straight. “Ruining” my seniority. That’s 🤬 rich…..
I love flying with FOs that are like, “I really hope we don’t merge with anyone”. They obviously are clueless about SWAPA past merger history. If they were educated on it they’d be praying that we bought someone. I’m sure they’d get to enjoy some of those sweet “captured” captain seats.
Pulleeez. Spare me the bologna and let’s keep the facts straight. “Ruining” my seniority. That’s 🤬 rich…..
11-21-2022, 10:55 AM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,803
As previously stated…..I’ll continue to call the bu!!$hit out as needed. In this case post #19. Don’t want to hear it? Use the ignore feature or don’t post bologna.
11-21-2022, 11:24 AM
#23
Furloughed Again?!
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Boeing 737
Posts: 4,804
Oh definitely not salivating. I have zero interest in a merger. I'm with you.
11-21-2022, 11:33 AM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2015
Posts: 643
This is the reason it needs to be brought up again. Not to argue with Wack, because he'll never see it any other way. There should be no way a "senior" guy from a stepping stone carrier gets seniority over us. And that's what might be coming down the sewer line if we let it. Instead of the 6-7 year upgrade new guys/gals might expect, it could easily get turned into 10-15 years. They need to know.
i recently had lunch with a kid just finishing up his commercial. He's going to be at a major/legacy within 2 years. Great kid. But he knows NOTHING about the airline business. Which means he has zero reference to where the many pitfalls and traps lay. No idea about unions... no idea about 50 billion in debt vs having money in the bank. (Why I wanted to come here even with huge shortcomings in equipment and mature contract items.) Even with all the warts, this place is sound for a pax carrying operation. That's why IMO we absolutely SHOULD get preference when merging with a far less financially secure company. ALPA merger policy is a equity scheme. Wait and see if any of the legacies try to fold their wholely owned regionals into their list. That stupid policy will evaporate like a fart in the wind.
11-21-2022, 11:38 AM
#25
weekends off? Nope...
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 2,021
It's funny to see guys salivating to see another merger and potentially allow hundreds of guys that started flying YEARS later than them to come in above them due to ridiculous relative seniority demands (say from the Virgin America guys that already got a windfall at Alaska)...
I'm ready to bring this place to it's knees in the form of a strike for our contract AND to keep from ruining my seniority for the rest of my career by fighting as hard as possible to keep that from happening. I wish the rest of you were. (No need to chime in Wack. I already know your argument.) My hope is that if they are going to go the route of a buyout, they wait to pick the bones clean after a chapter 7. Then they can offer selective but fast-tracked employment. Other than that, F all that merger crap.
I'm ready to bring this place to it's knees in the form of a strike for our contract AND to keep from ruining my seniority for the rest of my career by fighting as hard as possible to keep that from happening. I wish the rest of you were. (No need to chime in Wack. I already know your argument.) My hope is that if they are going to go the route of a buyout, they wait to pick the bones clean after a chapter 7. Then they can offer selective but fast-tracked employment. Other than that, F all that merger crap.
11-21-2022, 12:32 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,803
You were lucky to keep a job. And I'm not saying that to be derogatory. That was where your "shop" was heading. I got a bunch of people that never interviewed (or did but got turned down) above me. Over 1000. MANY for the rest of my time here. From SL 9 to 10, I got over 100 more stuffed in above me. It was a stepping stone company... That I could have gone to a DECADE before I started here. But I didn't want to work for such a place and potentially be furloughed at any moment.
This is the reason it needs to be brought up again. Not to argue with Wack, because he'll never see it any other way. There should be no way a "senior" guy from a stepping stone carrier gets seniority over us. And that's what might be coming down the sewer line if we let it. Instead of the 6-7 year upgrade new guys/gals might expect, it could easily get turned into 10-15 years. They need to know.
i recently had lunch with a kid just finishing up his commercial. He's going to be at a major/legacy within 2 years. Great kid. But he knows NOTHING about the airline business. Which means he has zero reference to where the many pitfalls and traps lay. No idea about unions... no idea about 50 billion in debt vs having money in the bank. (Why I wanted to come here even with huge shortcomings in equipment and mature contract items.) Even with all the warts, this place is sound for a pax carrying operation. That's why IMO we absolutely SHOULD get preference when merging with a far less financially secure company. ALPA merger policy is a equity scheme. Wait and see if any of the legacies try to fold their wholely owned regionals into their list. That stupid policy will evaporate like a fart in the wind.
This is the reason it needs to be brought up again. Not to argue with Wack, because he'll never see it any other way. There should be no way a "senior" guy from a stepping stone carrier gets seniority over us. And that's what might be coming down the sewer line if we let it. Instead of the 6-7 year upgrade new guys/gals might expect, it could easily get turned into 10-15 years. They need to know.
i recently had lunch with a kid just finishing up his commercial. He's going to be at a major/legacy within 2 years. Great kid. But he knows NOTHING about the airline business. Which means he has zero reference to where the many pitfalls and traps lay. No idea about unions... no idea about 50 billion in debt vs having money in the bank. (Why I wanted to come here even with huge shortcomings in equipment and mature contract items.) Even with all the warts, this place is sound for a pax carrying operation. That's why IMO we absolutely SHOULD get preference when merging with a far less financially secure company. ALPA merger policy is a equity scheme. Wait and see if any of the legacies try to fold their wholely owned regionals into their list. That stupid policy will evaporate like a fart in the wind.
By your line of reasoning I’m sure you’d advocate for a stapling & “capturing” of all captain seats in the event of an F9 merger.
There’s a reason why other pilot groups generally want nothing to do with SWA buying them. There’s also a reason the term “getting AirTraned” exists. Think about it.
11-21-2022, 12:55 PM
#27
gets time off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,234
You were lucky to keep a job. And I'm not saying that to be derogatory. That was where your "shop" was heading. I got a bunch of people that never interviewed (or did but got turned down) above me. Over 1000. MANY for the rest of my time here. From SL 9 to 10, I got over 100 more stuffed in above me. It was a stepping stone company... That I could have gone to a DECADE before I started here. But I didn't want to work for such a place and potentially be furloughed at any moment.
This is the reason it needs to be brought up again. Not to argue with Wack, because he'll never see it any other way. There should be no way a "senior" guy from a stepping stone carrier gets seniority over us. And that's what might be coming down the sewer line if we let it. Instead of the 6-7 year upgrade new guys/gals might expect, it could easily get turned into 10-15 years. They need to know.
i recently had lunch with a kid just finishing up his commercial. He's going to be at a major/legacy within 2 years. Great kid. But he knows NOTHING about the airline business. Which means he has zero reference to where the many pitfalls and traps lay. No idea about unions... no idea about 50 billion in debt vs having money in the bank. (Why I wanted to come here even with huge shortcomings in equipment and mature contract items.) Even with all the warts, this place is sound for a pax carrying operation. That's why IMO we absolutely SHOULD get preference when merging with a far less financially secure company. ALPA merger policy is an equity scheme. Wait and see if any of the legacies try to fold their wholely owned regionals into their list. That stupid policy will evaporate like a fart in the wind.
This is the reason it needs to be brought up again. Not to argue with Wack, because he'll never see it any other way. There should be no way a "senior" guy from a stepping stone carrier gets seniority over us. And that's what might be coming down the sewer line if we let it. Instead of the 6-7 year upgrade new guys/gals might expect, it could easily get turned into 10-15 years. They need to know.
i recently had lunch with a kid just finishing up his commercial. He's going to be at a major/legacy within 2 years. Great kid. But he knows NOTHING about the airline business. Which means he has zero reference to where the many pitfalls and traps lay. No idea about unions... no idea about 50 billion in debt vs having money in the bank. (Why I wanted to come here even with huge shortcomings in equipment and mature contract items.) Even with all the warts, this place is sound for a pax carrying operation. That's why IMO we absolutely SHOULD get preference when merging with a far less financially secure company. ALPA merger policy is an equity scheme. Wait and see if any of the legacies try to fold their wholely owned regionals into their list. That stupid policy will evaporate like a fart in the wind.
11-21-2022, 02:03 PM
#28
Strike averted!
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Position: B737
Posts: 3,789
All mergers will hurt someone. We need to look ahead as a unified group. SWA has never needed us more than now. We have the football and we need to keep the ball on the ground and run out the clock if we have to.
11-21-2022, 02:21 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,670
11-21-2022, 02:42 PM
#30
Spikes the Koolaid
Joined APC: Jul 2015
Position: 737
Posts: 403
When companies have the football (recession, financial troubles, etc) they have no problem threatening worse and worse concessions including bankruptcy-induced contracts. And they won't hesitate pulling the bankruptcy/furlough trigger (even SWA now, as evidenced by December 2020).
When we have the football, we need to show the company that we won't hesitate to pull the trigger unless we get .every.single.thing. we're asking for.
I believe the company. It's time they believed us.
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/11/21/business/railroad-unions-votes/index.html
We will be allowed to strike. We just have to use the levers at our disposal.
When we have the football, we need to show the company that we won't hesitate to pull the trigger unless we get .every.single.thing. we're asking for.
I believe the company. It's time they believed us.
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/11/21/business/railroad-unions-votes/index.html
We will be allowed to strike. We just have to use the levers at our disposal.
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