SWA or UAL
08-03-2022, 07:34 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,264
You MAKE time before your report. If you need coffee to function in the morning then the flight can leave late. IMSAFE
I’m so ******ing tired of this get the mission done at all costs mentality at SWA. I brief my entire crew that we cover each other’s asses on food, rest, physiological needs, etc and if we leave late because of it then so be it. Surprisingly, some of the responses I receive are as if I’m crazy for even suggesting that we delay a flight because of these basic human needs.
Just got into it with a gate age…..er “ops agent” 🙄in PHX because we had a plane swap and the FO and I went off to get food. She literally lied to scheduling and I called her out on it in a tactful but GFY kind of way, basically telling her that we don’t get crew meals, nor is there actual “real” food on the corndog airplanes so we need to go take care of food and bathroom breaks at some point in the day.
Does anyone have any friends at FedEx or UPS that can recommend me? I’m so done with dealing with FA drama, crowded terminals, diversity and inclusion, ground ops bu!!$hit, rampers with major attitudes, death by RBFs, tech debt, a “laser focused” and “right where we want to be” operation that’s in complete shambles, making “sorry about the Wi-Fi not working” PAs, and having a woke CEO that’s more concerned about apologizing about his “bullet points” than the operation that is crumbling around him.
What a freakin’ clown show this airline is.
I’m so ******ing tired of this get the mission done at all costs mentality at SWA. I brief my entire crew that we cover each other’s asses on food, rest, physiological needs, etc and if we leave late because of it then so be it. Surprisingly, some of the responses I receive are as if I’m crazy for even suggesting that we delay a flight because of these basic human needs.
Just got into it with a gate age…..er “ops agent” 🙄in PHX because we had a plane swap and the FO and I went off to get food. She literally lied to scheduling and I called her out on it in a tactful but GFY kind of way, basically telling her that we don’t get crew meals, nor is there actual “real” food on the corndog airplanes so we need to go take care of food and bathroom breaks at some point in the day.
Does anyone have any friends at FedEx or UPS that can recommend me? I’m so done with dealing with FA drama, crowded terminals, diversity and inclusion, ground ops bu!!$hit, rampers with major attitudes, death by RBFs, tech debt, a “laser focused” and “right where we want to be” operation that’s in complete shambles, making “sorry about the Wi-Fi not working” PAs, and having a woke CEO that’s more concerned about apologizing about his “bullet points” than the operation that is crumbling around him.
What a freakin’ clown show this airline is.
I could spend all of my time, and I have done so for periods in the past, trying to take a stand, but it is genuinely pointless. It’s way too stressful and crazy-making.
It’s like the little Dutch boy trying to plug 10,000 leaks in the dike with ten fingers and ten toes. It’s like a zombie movie - no matter how many zombies get killed, they just mindlessly and relentlessly keep coming.
Take the RLA, for example. As anyone who has spent any time here knows, that’s kind of my topic. It’s so utterly clear to me that we could leverage the RLA to our benefit. But the culture here is simply shut off to the idea. No matter how much evidence is provided to contradict the myths that prevail about the RLA, our pilots simply don’t want to believe it. It’s just not something that’s going to change. It’s like trying to convince a flat-earther to sail past the horizon. And that’s just how it is here in a bazillion other ways. It’s frustrating but fighting it is just tilting at windmills.
08-04-2022, 01:49 AM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,803
She lied to them and said my FO was worried about where I was (which is 100% false). She just wanted an excuse to call CS to check on where I was since it took me a while to go get Panera in PHX.
My FO got to the new airplane quicker than I did and CS called him asking about this. He told them that he never said such a thing and the scheduler’s response was basically “I figured as much”.
We pushed late but not before I made it known to her that she was out of line and pointed out the obvious that we don’t have “real food”’ on our aircraft like the Legacies do, nor do we get crew meals, nor are we mechanical robots that can just keep plugging along all day without having to attend to physiological needs.
My FO got to the new airplane quicker than I did and CS called him asking about this. He told them that he never said such a thing and the scheduler’s response was basically “I figured as much”.
We pushed late but not before I made it known to her that she was out of line and pointed out the obvious that we don’t have “real food”’ on our aircraft like the Legacies do, nor do we get crew meals, nor are we mechanical robots that can just keep plugging along all day without having to attend to physiological needs.
08-04-2022, 02:00 AM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,803
I mostly agree with you. The only thing is that there are SO many battles to fight that, speaking for myself, I have driven myself, and probably others, crazy trying to fight too many of them. This place is not going to change culturally in any significant way for a very long time.
I could spend all of my time, and I have done so for periods in the past, trying to take a stand, but it is genuinely pointless. It’s way too stressful and crazy-making.
It’s like the little Dutch boy trying to plug 10,000 leaks in the dike with ten fingers and ten toes. It’s like a zombie movie - no matter how many zombies get killed, they just mindlessly and relentlessly keep coming.
Take the RLA, for example. As anyone who has spent any time here knows, that’s kind of my topic. It’s so utterly clear to me that we could leverage the RLA to our benefit. But the culture here is simply shut off to the idea. No matter how much evidence is provided to contradict the myths that prevail about the RLA, our pilots simply don’t want to believe it. It’s just not something that’s going to change. It’s like trying to convince a flat-earther to sail past the horizon. And that’s just how it is here in a bazillion other ways. It’s frustrating but fighting it is just tilting at windmills.
I could spend all of my time, and I have done so for periods in the past, trying to take a stand, but it is genuinely pointless. It’s way too stressful and crazy-making.
It’s like the little Dutch boy trying to plug 10,000 leaks in the dike with ten fingers and ten toes. It’s like a zombie movie - no matter how many zombies get killed, they just mindlessly and relentlessly keep coming.
Take the RLA, for example. As anyone who has spent any time here knows, that’s kind of my topic. It’s so utterly clear to me that we could leverage the RLA to our benefit. But the culture here is simply shut off to the idea. No matter how much evidence is provided to contradict the myths that prevail about the RLA, our pilots simply don’t want to believe it. It’s just not something that’s going to change. It’s like trying to convince a flat-earther to sail past the horizon. And that’s just how it is here in a bazillion other ways. It’s frustrating but fighting it is just tilting at windmills.
As for the RLA, because of my past union roles I am very well versed in it. I’ve recently inquired into why we haven’t filed for mediation and the impression that I get is SWAPA is just hoping the Kompany will come to the table because of market forces. That and they’re waiting for the Legacies to go first and set the bar that we can then piggyback.
08-04-2022, 02:04 AM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,803
……and yes, it is exceedingly frustrating to witness the ignorance and indifference amongst our pilot group to the RLA and how much it effects negotiations (screws us, that is).
08-04-2022, 04:46 AM
#35
Spikes the Koolaid
Joined APC: Jul 2015
Position: 737
Posts: 403
I would not do this under any circumstance. Uber/lyft try to make sure all their drivers have insurance that covers driving for compensation, but a good friend of mine was in an uber-at-fault accident where their insurance denied their claim because they didn't have commercial insurance. Luckily they were on their own time and their insurance covered my injuries and damage and sued the other driver to get their money back.
An accident at work would almost certainly be punted to an OJI claim, and at this company I have no doubt SWA would deny such a claim by saying that you elected to drive with somebody who wasn't properly qualified when they provided a paid-for commercially vetted option. Even if you got cab authorized on your board, if you cab it, I would definitely only CAB it.
If they send you a lyft-link, as they have for me before, then take the lyft/uber, because then the onus is on them to vet. But otherwise, licensed cabby or hotel transportation only.
An accident at work would almost certainly be punted to an OJI claim, and at this company I have no doubt SWA would deny such a claim by saying that you elected to drive with somebody who wasn't properly qualified when they provided a paid-for commercially vetted option. Even if you got cab authorized on your board, if you cab it, I would definitely only CAB it.
If they send you a lyft-link, as they have for me before, then take the lyft/uber, because then the onus is on them to vet. But otherwise, licensed cabby or hotel transportation only.
08-04-2022, 05:56 AM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,778
I would not do this under any circumstance. Uber/lyft try to make sure all their drivers have insurance that covers driving for compensation, but a good friend of mine was in an uber-at-fault accident where their insurance denied their claim because they didn't have commercial insurance. Luckily they were on their own time and their insurance covered my injuries and damage and sued the other driver to get their money back.
An accident at work would almost certainly be punted to an OJI claim, and at this company I have no doubt SWA would deny such a claim by saying that you elected to drive with somebody who wasn't properly qualified when they provided a paid-for commercially vetted option. Even if you got cab authorized on your board, if you cab it, I would definitely only CAB it.
If they send you a lyft-link, as they have for me before, then take the lyft/uber, because then the onus is on them to vet. But otherwise, licensed cabby or hotel transportation only.
An accident at work would almost certainly be punted to an OJI claim, and at this company I have no doubt SWA would deny such a claim by saying that you elected to drive with somebody who wasn't properly qualified when they provided a paid-for commercially vetted option. Even if you got cab authorized on your board, if you cab it, I would definitely only CAB it.
If they send you a lyft-link, as they have for me before, then take the lyft/uber, because then the onus is on them to vet. But otherwise, licensed cabby or hotel transportation only.
08-04-2022, 06:19 AM
#37
Spikes the Koolaid
Joined APC: Jul 2015
Position: 737
Posts: 403
I guess I'm just not willing to risk either my 8 figure career or the short term possibility of 5-6 figures out of pocket when OJI is denied and then my personal insurance is denied because I already tried to OJI it. I mean risk/benefit analysis is I'm risking my career or 5-6 figures in order to do what? Make sure that we're at the gate on time so that we can push late waiting for the ramp to load the bags?
No thanks, I don't trust the company to do the right thing. Ask anybody you know if they've had a seemless OJI experience with the company. I don't know a single person who has.
08-04-2022, 08:01 AM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2016
Posts: 252
You MAKE time before your report. If you need coffee to function in the morning then the flight can leave late. IMSAFE
I’m so ******ing tired of this get the mission done at all costs mentality at SWA. I brief my entire crew that we cover each other’s asses on food, rest, physiological needs, etc and if we leave late because of it then so be it. Surprisingly, some of the responses I receive are as if I’m crazy for even suggesting that we delay a flight because of these basic human needs.
Just got into it with a gate age…..er “ops agent” 🙄in PHX because we had a plane swap and the FO and I went off to get food. She literally lied to scheduling and I called her out on it in a tactful but GFY kind of way, basically telling her that we don’t get crew meals, nor is there actual “real” food on the corndog airplanes so we need to go take care of food and bathroom breaks at some point in the day.
Does anyone have any friends at FedEx or UPS that can recommend me? I’m so done with dealing with FA drama, crowded terminals, diversity and inclusion, ground ops bu!!$hit, rampers with major attitudes, death by RBFs, tech debt, a “laser focused” and “right where we want to be” operation that’s in complete shambles, making “sorry about the Wi-Fi not working” PAs, and having a woke CEO that’s more concerned about apologizing about his “bullet points” than the operation that is crumbling around him.
What a freakin’ clown show this airline is.
I’m so ******ing tired of this get the mission done at all costs mentality at SWA. I brief my entire crew that we cover each other’s asses on food, rest, physiological needs, etc and if we leave late because of it then so be it. Surprisingly, some of the responses I receive are as if I’m crazy for even suggesting that we delay a flight because of these basic human needs.
Just got into it with a gate age…..er “ops agent” 🙄in PHX because we had a plane swap and the FO and I went off to get food. She literally lied to scheduling and I called her out on it in a tactful but GFY kind of way, basically telling her that we don’t get crew meals, nor is there actual “real” food on the corndog airplanes so we need to go take care of food and bathroom breaks at some point in the day.
Does anyone have any friends at FedEx or UPS that can recommend me? I’m so done with dealing with FA drama, crowded terminals, diversity and inclusion, ground ops bu!!$hit, rampers with major attitudes, death by RBFs, tech debt, a “laser focused” and “right where we want to be” operation that’s in complete shambles, making “sorry about the Wi-Fi not working” PAs, and having a woke CEO that’s more concerned about apologizing about his “bullet points” than the operation that is crumbling around him.
What a freakin’ clown show this airline is.
08-04-2022, 08:41 AM
#39
gets time off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,234
I’m one of those also. Had that discussion with my UOE CKA assistant chief. I told him I’ll delay every time if myself or crew need food. He mentioned other stupid options ie carrying food, cliff bars etc. I said that won’t do and I would delay. He said I would probably be explaining to the chiefs. I said fine let’s see how the FAA feels about crew not getting nourishment. That ended the discussion.
I need more rest then the min 10hrs and don’t extend. My life and the passengers are counting on it. It only takes one time to make a mistake. I can control some of the factors.
I need more rest then the min 10hrs and don’t extend. My life and the passengers are counting on it. It only takes one time to make a mistake. I can control some of the factors.
08-04-2022, 08:50 AM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,153
It shouldn't have to be said out loud, but some managers simply forget that we need an untarnished license and a healthy body more than we need any one particular job. With good health and a record untarnished by mishaps, revocations, checkride fails, etc, I can get another job. Any pressure from any company that bumps up against that reality is going to get pushback, up to and including quitting. I had to spell it out for an instructor once when I was being pressured to go to an oral exam without being fully prepared. He kept pushing until I told him I was either getting one day off or I was going to ask HR for a ticket home. You could almost see the lightbulb turn on in his brain when he realized I was dead serious and would walk away over something that cost the company nothing but a phone call, but meant everything in the world to me.
Fatigue, sick, nutrition, all that falls under the same umbrella. With very few exceptions, almost anyone here can take their license and medical to another company and get another job. It sucks if your chief pilot forgets that and needs to be reminded that you need your medical and license more than you need this particular job, but sometimes it just has to be laid out using short words and direct statements.
Fatigue, sick, nutrition, all that falls under the same umbrella. With very few exceptions, almost anyone here can take their license and medical to another company and get another job. It sucks if your chief pilot forgets that and needs to be reminded that you need your medical and license more than you need this particular job, but sometimes it just has to be laid out using short words and direct statements.
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